T Nation

Another Look at Flyes

i like power flies a lot better.

[quote]PB Andy wrote:
i like power flies a lot better.

[/quote]

Perhaps so.

But my reason for the traditional Flye was out of necessity in avoiding aggravating a pending injury. Pressing is out of the question - in any form.

Instead, the Flye, performed as Arnold once described “like hugging a large tree”, is favorable in my case.

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]PB Andy wrote:
i like power flies a lot better.

[/quote]

Perhaps so.

But my reason for the traditional Flye was out of necessity in avoiding aggravating a pending injury. Pressing is out of the question - in any form.

Instead, the Flye, performed as Arnold once described “like hugging a large tree”, is favorable in my case. [/quote]

I wrote something about dealing with elbow injuries and have linked it to you in two different threads and you never responded to either of my posts, so I’m not sure if you never saw my posts or if you’re ignoring me. Please read my post.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/training_triceps_without_heavy_weight?id=5288275&pageNo=0

Edit: link works now

[quote]yvanehtnioj wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]PB Andy wrote:
i like power flies a lot better.

[/quote]

Perhaps so.

But my reason for the traditional Flye was out of necessity in avoiding aggravating a pending injury. Pressing is out of the question - in any form.

Instead, the Flye, performed as Arnold once described “like hugging a large tree”, is favorable in my case. [/quote]

I wrote something about dealing with elbow injuries and have linked it to you in two different threads and you never responded to either of my posts, so I’m not sure if you never saw my posts or if you’re ignoring me. Please read my post.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/...75&pageNo=0[/quote]

That link doesn’t work.

incline cable flies with the bench a bit farther out so that it pulls back at a nice anlge actually helped my shoulder feel better.

[quote]LoRez wrote:

[quote]yvanehtnioj wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]PB Andy wrote:
i like power flies a lot better.

[/quote]

Perhaps so.

But my reason for the traditional Flye was out of necessity in avoiding aggravating a pending injury. Pressing is out of the question - in any form.

Instead, the Flye, performed as Arnold once described “like hugging a large tree”, is favorable in my case. [/quote]

I wrote something about dealing with elbow injuries and have linked it to you in two different threads and you never responded to either of my posts, so I’m not sure if you never saw my posts or if you’re ignoring me. Please read my post.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/...75&pageNo=0[/quote]

That link doesn’t work.[/quote]

Thank you. I just edited my post. My response is towards the bottom of the first page

[quote]yvanehtnioj wrote:

I wrote something about dealing with elbow injuries and have linked it to you in two different threads and you never responded to either of my posts, so I’m not sure if you never saw my posts or if you’re ignoring me. Please read my post.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/training_triceps_without_heavy_weight?id=5288275&pageNo=0

Edit: link works now[/quote]

My sincerest apologies, Yvanehtnioj, for not responding to you.

Yes, I did read your excellent post. Very informative! However, in order to determine the cause of my issue, I’m taking one thing at a time. Also, based on the things my ART doctor told me and worked on, there’s some validity to some of your recommendations.
I will be looking into them again shortly.

The thing is, this is the 3rd time I’m dealing with many months of tendinitis in both knees and both elbows simultaneously. That tells me it’s most likely more of a systemic issue, than an individual problem with specific parts. I could be wrong… which makes this so damn frustrating again and again!

I’ll let you know what I find, after reviewing your list again.

Thanks!

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]yvanehtnioj wrote:

I wrote something about dealing with elbow injuries and have linked it to you in two different threads and you never responded to either of my posts, so I’m not sure if you never saw my posts or if you’re ignoring me. Please read my post.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/training_triceps_without_heavy_weight?id=5288275&pageNo=0

Edit: link works now[/quote]

My sincerest apologies, Yvanehtnioj, for not responding to you.

Yes, I did read your excellent post. Very informative! However, in order to determine the cause of my issue, I’m taking one thing at a time. Also, based on the things my ART doctor told me and worked on, there’s some validity to some of your recommendations.
I will be looking into them again shortly.

The thing is, this is the 3rd time I’m dealing with many months of tendinitis in both knees and both elbows simultaneously. That tells me it’s most likely more of a systemic issue, than an individual problem with specific parts. I could be wrong… which makes this so damn frustrating again and again!

I’ll let you know what I find, after reviewing your list again.

Thanks!

[/quote]

You don’t have to apologize. No offense taken at all. Glad you enjoyed my post. I wish you the best of luck on your recovery. Please update this thread when you get your issues under control.

Also, nearly all of the suggestions made on the list can be applied to your knees as well. I’ve been using them with great success on both my knees and elbows. As I said before in my post, read over Eric Cressey’s injury articles and go to mobilitywod.com, because these types of injuries are commonly systemic issues like you acknowledged. I’m also going to edit the list again, because I found one or two more things that’s helped me.

Good luck and keep us updated

[quote]yvanehtnioj wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]yvanehtnioj wrote:

I wrote something about dealing with elbow injuries and have linked it to you in two different threads and you never responded to either of my posts, so I’m not sure if you never saw my posts or if you’re ignoring me. Please read my post.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/training_triceps_without_heavy_weight?id=5288275&pageNo=0

Edit: link works now[/quote]

My sincerest apologies, Yvanehtnioj, for not responding to you.

Yes, I did read your excellent post. Very informative! However, in order to determine the cause of my issue, I’m taking one thing at a time. Also, based on the things my ART doctor told me and worked on, there’s some validity to some of your recommendations.
I will be looking into them again shortly.

The thing is, this is the 3rd time I’m dealing with many months of tendinitis in both knees and both elbows simultaneously. That tells me it’s most likely more of a systemic issue, than an individual problem with specific parts. I could be wrong… which makes this so damn frustrating again and again!

I’ll let you know what I find, after reviewing your list again.

Thanks!

[/quote]

You don’t have to apologize. No offense taken at all. Glad you enjoyed my post. I wish you the best of luck on your recovery. Please update this thread when you get your issues under control.

Also, nearly all of the suggestions made on the list can be applied to your knees as well. I’ve been using them with great success on both my knees and elbows. As I said before in my post, read over Eric Cressey’s injury articles and go to mobilitywod.com, because these types of injuries are commonly systemic issues like you acknowledged. I’m also going to edit the list again, because I found one or two more things that’s helped me.

Good luck and keep us updated
[/quote]

Thanks again, I will.

Your info should be a sticky.

:slight_smile:

If you have access to Rings/TRX straps you can really light your chest up with suspended flies. The unstable nature of the exercise gets your stabilizers firing like crazy too, you’ll be shaking like a parkinsons pt in the snow if you havent tried them before.

I feel your pain Iron dwarf, as i had tendonitis on my right elbow which eventually progressd to shoulder impingement in same side due to compensation. my elbows are good now and sholder is on thei way back to former strength/health. many training injuries occur due to pattern overload. this is the reason why i feel constant change in angles, grip width, how you hold the bar, grip style(pron, sup, neutral),and exercises. one thing i remember when i was really at my strongest on bench, I’d feel m biceps ‘‘puling’’ the weight when I was pressing, kind of how hamstrngs take good chunk of work when squatting. I think the flies not bothering your shoulder is a sign that bicep use was what was missing on your presses and force elbow to take blunt of work. keep doing the flies to build some strength back and progress into flye/press, then full press but make sure the biceps are firing as well. good luck, you’ll come out of it.

[quote]myosaurus wrote:
I feel your pain Iron dwarf, as i had tendonitis on my right elbow which eventually progressd to shoulder impingement in same side due to compensation. my elbows are good now and sholder is on thei way back to former strength/health. many training injuries occur due to pattern overload. this is the reason why i feel constant change in angles, grip width, how you hold the bar, grip style(pron, sup, neutral),and exercises. one thing i remember when i was really at my strongest on bench, I’d feel m biceps ‘‘puling’’ the weight when I was pressing, kind of how hamstrngs take good chunk of work when squatting. I think the flies not bothering your shoulder is a sign that bicep use was what was missing on your presses and force elbow to take blunt of work. keep doing the flies to build some strength back and progress into flye/press, then full press but make sure the biceps are firing as well. good luck, you’ll come out of it.[/quote]

is there anyway we could do a Q and A with ya man? the things you post are super informative, logical, well explained, and super important. I wish as im sure you do, that i knew all of these things back when i started! I appreciate all of your posts man, you look beast and im sure everyone else will agree. If not…they are stupid.

That’s a great point, Myo!

In fact, last year when both shoulders were at a critical point, my muscle therapy dr made an adjustment, then told me to do 30 hammer curls every day! He knew it was actually my bicep tendons being the problem.

Good post!

[quote]bignate wrote:

[quote]myosaurus wrote:
I feel your pain Iron dwarf, as i had tendonitis on my right elbow which eventually progressd to shoulder impingement in same side due to compensation. my elbows are good now and sholder is on thei way back to former strength/health. many training injuries occur due to pattern overload. this is the reason why i feel constant change in angles, grip width, how you hold the bar, grip style(pron, sup, neutral),and exercises. one thing i remember when i was really at my strongest on bench, I’d feel m biceps ‘‘puling’’ the weight when I was pressing, kind of how hamstrngs take good chunk of work when squatting. I think the flies not bothering your shoulder is a sign that bicep use was what was missing on your presses and force elbow to take blunt of work. keep doing the flies to build some strength back and progress into flye/press, then full press but make sure the biceps are firing as well. good luck, you’ll come out of it.[/quote]

is there anyway we could do a Q and A with ya man? the things you post are super informative, logical, well explained, and super important. I wish as im sure you do, that i knew all of these things back when i started! I appreciate all of your posts man, you look beast and im sure everyone else will agree. If not…they are stupid. [/quote]

X2

It’s always a blessing when someone with your size and experience takes the time to help out so extensively around here.

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]bignate wrote:

[quote]myosaurus wrote:
I feel your pain Iron dwarf, as i had tendonitis on my right elbow which eventually progressd to shoulder impingement in same side due to compensation. my elbows are good now and sholder is on thei way back to former strength/health. many training injuries occur due to pattern overload. this is the reason why i feel constant change in angles, grip width, how you hold the bar, grip style(pron, sup, neutral),and exercises. one thing i remember when i was really at my strongest on bench, I’d feel m biceps ‘‘puling’’ the weight when I was pressing, kind of how hamstrngs take good chunk of work when squatting. I think the flies not bothering your shoulder is a sign that bicep use was what was missing on your presses and force elbow to take blunt of work. keep doing the flies to build some strength back and progress into flye/press, then full press but make sure the biceps are firing as well. good luck, you’ll come out of it.[/quote]

is there anyway we could do a Q and A with ya man? the things you post are super informative, logical, well explained, and super important. I wish as im sure you do, that i knew all of these things back when i started! I appreciate all of your posts man, you look beast and im sure everyone else will agree. If not…they are stupid. [/quote]

X2

It’s always a blessing when someone with your size and experience takes the time to help out so extensively around here.

[/quote]

so…who wants to start a myosorous thread…!

[quote]bignate wrote:

so…who wants to start a myosorous thread…!
[/quote]

Already done:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:
Flyes! Iron Dwarf I could kiss your tiny face!

Shoulder’s been bothering me for ages so I haven’t been doing anything for chest for like 2 months. Flyes might just get me back in action.[/quote]

Cool! Start with flat flyes with light weight. Feel how far you can go within ROM before pain hits. Eventually find how much of an incline you can tolerate.

Warm up really well first!

Let me know how it goes.
I’m really excited about the prospect of this myself. Shoulder feels great today, while pecs are wrecked![/quote]

I reckon the way I’ll apprach it is to do a high rep set of flyes (say like 20 reps) and then go immediately into pressing the dumbells. It’ll be a ton of volume but the weights’ll be lighter so I think the shoulder’ll be ok.

This tip from John Meadows has helped me greatly

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]yvanehtnioj wrote:

I wrote something about dealing with elbow injuries and have linked it to you in two different threads and you never responded to either of my posts, so I’m not sure if you never saw my posts or if you’re ignoring me. Please read my post.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/training_triceps_without_heavy_weight?id=5288275&pageNo=0

Edit: link works now[/quote]

My sincerest apologies, Yvanehtnioj, for not responding to you.

Yes, I did read your excellent post. Very informative! However, in order to determine the cause of my issue, I’m taking one thing at a time. Also, based on the things my ART doctor told me and worked on, there’s some validity to some of your recommendations.
I will be looking into them again shortly.

The thing is, this is the 3rd time I’m dealing with many months of tendinitis in both knees and both elbows simultaneously. That tells me it’s most likely more of a systemic issue, than an individual problem with specific parts. I could be wrong… which makes this so damn frustrating again and again!

I’ll let you know what I find, after reviewing your list again.

Thanks!

[/quote]

Could ypu PM me name of your ART guy if you’re happy with results? I’m thinking of giving it a shot as last resort before getting shoulder surgery. Plus i have a boat load of mobility, tightness isues along with discomfort in so many areas. Thanks.

[quote]as wrote:

Could ypu PM me name of your ART guy if you’re happy with results? I’m thinking of giving it a shot as last resort before getting shoulder surgery. Plus i have a boat load of mobility, tightness isues along with discomfort in so many areas. Thanks.[/quote]

Check your PMs.

:slight_smile: