T Nation

Another Beginner Topic

I just want to know what everybody thinks about my workout.
one day on one day off rest on weekends.

3x8 bench press
3x8 Close-Grip Bench Press
2x10 dumbbell flies

4x8 ez-bar curls

2x6 side lateral raise
3x6 standing db press

3xF chin-ups
2x8 one-arm db row

3xF lying leg raises
3xF crunches

It’s been 8weeks and I see some improvement on the mirror a a lot improvement on my lifts.

I’m trying to get proportional so I’m not traning my legs for now. I have well developed legs because of my rowing background.

I eat a lot and try to eat clean. I eat every 4 hours so 4 times a day. About 200-220gr of protein and 3000 cals. About 3lts of water.

I am only taking creatine (5grams after workout) right now.

You need to work your legs. Working your legs will help you see even more “mirror improvements.”

Also IMO, 4 pressing movements and only 2 pulling movements is not a great idea. At least keep the ratio 1:1 of pressing movements and pulling movements. If you don’t you run the risk of getting yourself some pretty poor posture.

ditto on the legs. a high rep activity like rowing is not going to have the same impact as doing a set of squats.

I’d replace the 1-arm db rows with some high pulls, or cleans or snatches.

there’s a 100 better core exercises than crunches for instance: planks or hanging leg raises, Russian twists or wood choppers.

The best core exercises are squats, deadlifts, and standing overhead pressing.

OP, your program is FAR from optimal; but it is better than nothing I suppose.

I think in the future you should consider the ideas behind your plan and ask about them, It’s really difficult to see where you are going with a given plan when you just drop it on readers cold.

Ideas like “I’m trying to improve my pressing strength and pullup numbers” would help bring into perspective what that workout is trying to accopmlish, otherwise you are just throwing arbitrary numbers at us.

[quote]chrillionare wrote:
You need to work your legs. Working your legs will help you see even more “mirror improvements.”

Also IMO, 4 pressing movements and only 2 pulling movements is not a great idea. At least keep the ratio 1:1 of pressing movements and pulling movements. If you don’t you run the risk of getting yourself some pretty poor posture.[/quote]

I don’t get this. This is the first time I’m told about a press/pull ratio. Can you or anyone tell me more about this?

I agree with you about the legs. I will train my legs when my upper body catches up.

[quote]MC sp3 wrote:
The best core exercises are squats, deadlifts, and standing overhead pressing.

OP, your program is FAR from optimal; but it is better than nothing I suppose.[/quote]

So i should drop the back and ab exercise and replace them with compound core exercises like the deadlift? Did I get this right?

[quote]mchron wrote:
I think in the future you should consider the ideas behind your plan and ask about them, It’s really difficult to see where you are going with a given plan when you just drop it on readers cold.

Ideas like “I’m trying to improve my pressing strength and pullup numbers” would help bring into perspective what that workout is trying to accopmlish, otherwise you are just throwing arbitrary numbers at us.[/quote]

At least 14-15 pullups and a nice looking body. I do not have anything else in mind.

Just out of curiosity, what can you squat, deadlift, bench, and row?

Of course, even if your legs are stronger, training them will make your upper body strong, as well.

If you work presses more then pulls, you will develop your muscle unevenly. This can lead to poor posture and mobility issues, since one muscle group will be stronger then the other, and pull any attached joints towards it. By pairing exercises in a push/pull fashion, you can prevent this from happening. For example, bench press and seated rows, etc.

Additionally, you can superset the exercises so that one group rests while you exhaust the antagonist muscles, which can speed up your workout and actually lead to higher lift numbers since the antagonist muscles will be less able to resist your protagonist muscles.

[quote]colonelquack wrote:
Just out of curiosity, what can you squat, deadlift, bench, and row?

Of course, even if your legs are stronger, training them will make your upper body strong, as well.[/quote]

I don’t know about deadlift and the squat because I never tried them. I can bench 52kgs (app. 115 pounds) (3x8) I don’t know about 1RM never tried.

As I thought. If you have never even squatted or deadlifted, then your legs are weak.

[quote]yiltawar wrote:
colonelquack wrote:
Just out of curiosity, what can you squat, deadlift, bench, and row?

Of course, even if your legs are stronger, training them will make your upper body strong, as well.

I don’t know about deadlift and the squat because I never tried them. I can bench 52kgs (app. 115 pounds) (3x8) I don’t know about 1RM never tried.

[/quote]

you bench 115 pounds. Don’t give people lip about having developed legs. You don’t know developement. When we tell you to start squatting we aren’t kidding, if you don’t you’re selling yourself short. Not to mention admitting you’re too pussy to do real weights.

hit the squat rack.

are you doing the same work out 3 times a week? if i were you id try a split even if youre only training each bodypart once a week. i know alot of people get good results beginning with a full body routine but i just dont feel like i can recover completely if i get a good workout with one day of rest.

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
yiltawar wrote:
colonelquack wrote:
Just out of curiosity, what can you squat, deadlift, bench, and row?

Of course, even if your legs are stronger, training them will make your upper body strong, as well.

I don’t know about deadlift and the squat because I never tried them. I can bench 52kgs (app. 115 pounds) (3x8) I don’t know about 1RM never tried.

you bench 115 pounds. Don’t give people lip about having developed legs. You don’t know developement. When we tell you to start squatting we aren’t kidding, if you don’t you’re selling yourself short. Not to mention admitting you’re too pussy to do real weights.

hit the squat rack.[/quote]

Calm the fuck down. I just said my legs look larger compared to my upper body so I am not training them for a while until my upper body catches up.

You don’t need to let anything “catch up”. You do need to train your entire body to it’s fullest potential.

Judging by the fact that you have never performed a squat or a deadlift, and your flat bb bench press is only 115 it is extremely likely that your lower body and back are just as weak as your chest and arms.

A strong back and lower body drastically increase your general athleticism and allow you to control heavier weights with your upper body as well.

I mean no offense, but to neglect your lower body because you are worried about your legs getting “too big” is just plain stupid. I seriously doubt you will be hitting the level of intensity required to get such a growth surge from your legs. In all likelihood, if you train them sufficiently, they will appear more toned and aesthetically pleasing than before.

Whatever program you chose should include (at a minimum)compound pulling and pushing movements in both the vertical and horizontal plains of motion.
ex: horizontal push = bench press
horizontal pull = row
vertical push = military press
vertical pull = chinups/pullups
lower push = back squat/front squat/lunges
lower pull = dead lift std./RDL/etc.

Many of these compound have associated isolation exercises that complement them. ex: curls, skullcrushers, leg extensions, lateral db raises.

As a beginner you should focus primarily on the compound exercises and (in general) add extra isolation to the program for lagging bodyparts. This is not to say that you should avoid iso work. What it does mean is that heavy compounds are the meat and potatoes of a good beginner program and isolation exercises are the dessert. Add them where they are needed, but not at the expense of progression on your compound movements.

You will do yourself a big favor by reading the beginner stickies and the “designing a good program” thread.

http://www.T-Nation.com/readArticle.do?id=1701042

If you have questions about specific movements, this is a good resource.

http://www.exrx.net/Lists/Directory.html

Good luck,
JH

If you’ve never done squats or deads, then I’m guessing that your upper body doesn’t really have much of anything to “catch up” to.

Don’t ignore your lower body. You might as well work it along with the upper.

Also, you should consider maybe an upper/lower split, or ANY split for that matter.

[EDIT] haha… MC said it waaay better. Good advice.

[quote]MC sp3 wrote:
You don’t need to let anything “catch up”. You do need to train your entire body to it’s fullest potential.

Judging by the fact that you have never performed a squat or a deadlift, and your flat bb bench press is only 115 it is extremely likely that your lower body and back are just as weak as your chest and arms.

A strong back and lower body drastically increase your general athleticism and allow you to control heavier weights with your upper body as well.

I mean no offense, but to neglect your lower body because you are worried about your legs getting “too big” is just plain stupid. I seriously doubt you will be hitting the level of intensity required to get such a growth surge from your legs. In all likelihood, if you train them sufficiently, they will appear more toned and aesthetically pleasing than before.

Whatever program you chose should include (at a minimum)compound pulling and pushing movements in both the vertical and horizontal plains of motion.
ex: horizontal push = bench press
horizontal pull = row
vertical push = military press
vertical pull = chinups/pullups
lower push = back squat/front squat/lunges
lower pull = dead lift std./RDL/etc.

Many of these compound have associated isolation exercises that complement them. ex: curls, skullcrushers, leg extensions, lateral db raises.

As a beginner you should focus primarily on the compound exercises and (in general) add extra isolation to the program for lagging bodyparts. This is not to say that you should avoid iso work. What it does mean is that heavy compounds are the meat and potatoes of a good beginner program and isolation exercises are the dessert. Add them where they are needed, but not at the expense of progression on your compound movements.

You will do yourself a big favor by reading the beginner stickies and the “designing a good program” thread.

http://www.T-Nation.com/readArticle.do?id=1701042

If you have questions about specific movements, this is a good resource.

http://www.exrx.net/Lists/Directory.html

Good luck,
JH
[/quote]

That is good advice. Thank you. I will fix the push-pull ratio, add compounds. What should be the rep/set range with the compounds?

[quote]MC sp3 wrote:
You don’t need to let anything “catch up”. You do need to train your entire body to it’s fullest potential.

Judging by the fact that you have never performed a squat or a deadlift, and your flat bb bench press is only 115 it is extremely likely that your lower body and back are just as weak as your chest and arms.

A strong back and lower body drastically increase your general athleticism and allow you to control heavier weights with your upper body as well.

I mean no offense, but to neglect your lower body because you are worried about your legs getting “too big” is just plain stupid. I seriously doubt you will be hitting the level of intensity required to get such a growth surge from your legs. In all likelihood, if you train them sufficiently, they will appear more toned and aesthetically pleasing than before.

Whatever program you chose should include (at a minimum)compound pulling and pushing movements in both the vertical and horizontal plains of motion.
ex: horizontal push = bench press
horizontal pull = row
vertical push = military press
vertical pull = chinups/pullups
lower push = back squat/front squat/lunges
lower pull = dead lift std./RDL/etc.

Many of these compound have associated isolation exercises that complement them. ex: curls, skullcrushers, leg extensions, lateral db raises.

As a beginner you should focus primarily on the compound exercises and (in general) add extra isolation to the program for lagging bodyparts. This is not to say that you should avoid iso work. What it does mean is that heavy compounds are the meat and potatoes of a good beginner program and isolation exercises are the dessert. Add them where they are needed, but not at the expense of progression on your compound movements.

You will do yourself a big favor by reading the beginner stickies and the “designing a good program” thread.

http://www.T-Nation.com/readArticle.do?id=1701042

If you have questions about specific movements, this is a good resource.

http://www.exrx.net/Lists/Directory.html

Good luck,
JH
[/quote]

That is good advice. Thank you. I will fix the push-pull ratio, add compounds. What should be the rep/set range with the compounds?

hey, I’m doing a program I found on T-Nation with three of my friends and we’re all seeing massive gains. Its called the superhero workout by Christian Thibaudeau.

here’s the workout
http://www.T-Nation.com/portal_includes/articles/2006/06-021B-training.html

and here’s the article where the workout was derived from, I would highly recommend reading it. In fact, its a must read.

Just follow this program in the four week phases (you can take a rest week between phases if you need too) and you’ll be stronger and bigger than ever before, no joke.

If you have any questions about the exercises or anything just ask…

hope this helps…

Just in case the OP forgot what a human body looks like…the legs are always bigger then the upper body. Consider that your upper arm should measure roughly the same as your calves…which is probably around half the size of your thighs.

In other words…

Squat + Deadlift + Row + Bench + FOOD.

[quote]MC sp3 wrote:
You don’t need to let anything “catch up”. You do need to train your entire body to it’s fullest potential.

Judging by the fact that you have never performed a squat or a deadlift, and your flat bb bench press is only 115 it is extremely likely that your lower body and back are just as weak as your chest and arms.

A strong back and lower body drastically increase your general athleticism and allow you to control heavier weights with your upper body as well.

I mean no offense, but to neglect your lower body because you are worried about your legs getting “too big” is just plain stupid. I seriously doubt you will be hitting the level of intensity required to get such a growth surge from your legs.

In all likelihood, if you train them sufficiently, they will appear more toned and aesthetically pleasing than before.

Whatever program you chose should include (at a minimum)compound pulling and pushing movements in both the vertical and horizontal plains of motion.

ex: horizontal push = bench press
horizontal pull = row
vertical push = military press
vertical pull = chinups/pullups
lower push = back squat/front squat/lunges
lower pull = dead lift std./RDL/etc.

Many of these compound have associated isolation exercises that complement them. ex: curls, skullcrushers, leg extensions, lateral db raises.

As a beginner you should focus primarily on the compound exercises and (in general) add extra isolation to the program for lagging bodyparts. This is not to say that you should avoid iso work.

What it does mean is that heavy compounds are the meat and potatoes of a good beginner program and isolation exercises are the dessert. Add them where they are needed, but not at the expense of progression on your compound movements.

You will do yourself a big favor by reading the beginner stickies and the “designing a good program” thread.

http://www.T-Nation.com/readArticle.do?id=1701042

If you have questions about specific movements, this is a good resource.

http://www.exrx.net/Lists/Directory.html

Good luck,
JH
[/quote]

great post. Basically covers everything a beginner would need to know.

OP: good luck, let us know what you try.