T Nation

Androgel Max Dose 10Gr: Why?

Hey Guys, I’m simply wondering why the max dose of Androgel is 10 grams a day. I understand that, at best, someone can absorb 10% of the application for a total of 70 mg a week. This is considerably lower than a starting dose of Test E or Test C. I asked my Endo this very question after he agreed to let me switch to shots staring at 100 mg/week. He had no answer to the question. I have read in the threads that Androgel is more easily converted to E2 and DHT. Is this the reason or am I missing something?

Yes, transdermals create more E2 and DHT.

100mg/day of transdermal at 10% absorption would be 10mg/day.

100mg/week injected T ester yields about 10mg/day after the ester groups are removed.

But it is rare to see a guy on transdermals get to the levels of guys injecting 100mg/week.

Some cannot absorb at all and some do then it stops. Inability to absorb is a symptom of hypothyroidism.

Given the costs [and waste] of Androgen and other transdermals, high doses are simply expensive.

So, will this now be your thread? Can you post your labs? Read the advice for new guys sticky. Do not self inject once a week, twice a week or EOD. Read the protocol for injections sticky.

Thanks for the reply. I have purposely withheld posting anything regarding my TRT situation as my labs are nothing more than Testosterone numbers. I have spent an incredible amount of time reading the stickies and other peoples threads to gain some knowledge about HRT. On occasion I cannot find anwers to a specific question such as the one above. I have an appointment on the 31st and am going to take a number of your Stickies with me in an effort to get comprehensive labs and possibly an AI. I have a history of gyno (twice with no anabolic use) which is very concerning to me as I try to raise my low T levels. To date my Endo will not even entertain the use of an AI or HCG. I have done research and identified two doctors in my area who have prescribed an AI or HCG in certain circumstances. I will change doctors if I get nowhere on the 31st. I will also post my lab work when I get something more than T levels. Thanks for the time and effort you put into helping the guys on this site.

Not sure which topical you are talking about, but if its Androgel 1.62 the max dose is 4 pmps per day.
Each pump has 20.21mg of test, 4 pumps gets you about 81mg. The clinical trial put absorption btwn 8-10%.
Going with 8% you would be getting about 49mg per week, 10% would get you about 56mg per week.
With 100mg Tcyp you are actually getting 70mg after you subtract the weight of the ester, but you are getting the 70mg for sure.

On androgel my libido was somewhat higher, on Tcyp my over feelings of well being were much better. YMMV

The higher DHT levels from transdermals do have a libido advantage. With gels and large skin areas, the DHT increase is greater than from T creams that are applied to smaller skin areas.

I will add, libido was initially lower with injection. Since adding HCG (and having a cpl complications from it initially) the libido is back, and in a way that is above and beyond what I experienced with Androgel. It reminds me of the way I felt as a teenager. I have read it has do with having some of your own “brand” of test in your system…I agree.

And you need to remember that E2 is the bull in the china shop.

Here is a tidbit on E2, and the change from Topical to 3x per week Subq…because injection causes less conversion to E2 you will need to lower the amount of AI you were using. Learned this one the hard way.

Any warning signals, PKNY?

High E2 and low E2 are pretty much the same, you feel bitchy, angry inside…everything bothers you and your libido suffers (actually dies)…sexual performance too.
When your E2 is on the lower end of the spectrum you will also feel your joints ache.

When your E2 is high your joints won’t ache, but your libido will suffer and you will notice that
you are somewhat bloated.

Well I feel a little better about my E2 levels as the libido has never been better. Since upping to 10 grams I feel like a horny teenager. As KillerGoalie stated in his thread that the Sensitive Assay test in not available in our neck of the woods so it’s good to know about the symptomology of high E2. Thanks.