T Nation

Andogel Total T Drops to 60

Hi, my first post here, tried Googling but could not find an answer.

I’ve been on androgel since it first came to market at 5gms, about 2 or 3 years ago (really don’t remember)Doc raised it to 10Grms and total T was 777. next test was December 2011 it was 360. A couple of weeks ago it went down to 60. She said she didn’t know why it stopped working but suggested Testosterone Cypionate injections at 100mg once a week, haven’t had it rechecked yet. Has anyone ever heard of such a big drop with Andogel or why it would stop working?

Appreciate any help, thanks.

My levels were all over the place with the gel. It also depends on when the blood was drawn in relation to you put the gel on. I’m sure this is not new news to you; Just wanted to let you know I had a similar experience.

At 9am with 2 pumps of androgel 1.62%, my levels were 330. At 4pm with 3 pumps it was 301. At 11am with 3.5 pumps it was 755. Not quite the drop you had, though.

You would be much better off with testosterone cypionate injections. Self-injecting no less than 2x/week using small amount loaded into a 29gauge 0.5in syringe into the thigh. You are absorbing about 70% of each injection, as opposed to 10% of androgel if you’re lucky, which at this moment you very much aren’t.

Read through this and see if you can can on this protocol. You will have the best TRT experience. Pay particular attention to hCG and AI (arimidex/anastrozole). You’ll eventually want these as well.

If you have developed some degree of hypothyroidism, your ability to absorb transdermal T could be a result. This effect is a symptom of hypothyroidism. You might now be iodine deficient.

Do you have any lab data for: -post with lab ranges.
TSH*
T4
fT4*
T3
fT3*

  • get tested for these if you do not have the labs

Read the advice for new guys sticky, post body temperatures and iodine intake.

Yes, this is typical in some they start absorbing well and then stop. With LH and FSH suppressed (your not using HCG?) their T can be even lower than it was before treatment.

As KS said this is typically caused by thyroid, monitor your temperatures with thermometer.

Do you get cold easy?

Thanks Kaynon, I’ll check out that link! I had surgery not too long ago and they tested thyroid function and pretty much every important test there is. I don’t get cold easily, but I do get warm easily, have never been able to wear a sweater.

I forgot to mention that I’ve been taking Oxandrolone for about 2 years now, I came across this interesting bit of info regarding Oxandrolone lowering testosterone: “First pass metabolism of orally administered oxandrolone may decrease hepatic synthesis of SHBG, allowing exogenously supplied testosterone to be excreted.” So lower SHGB means lower Testosterone? I’m new to researching this stuff so maybe it’s not true or if it is it’s old info. In any event I decided to stop taking Oxandrolone and have my T tested after being on testosterone cypionate/100mg once a week for 8 weeks and if there’s enough of an improvement then I’ll just stay off the Oxandrolone. Here’s the link to that short article:

Will reduce T in normal men, no effect when on TRT.

When SHBG is lowered there is less SHBG+T which are tightly bound and that itself it not a loss as the T there is lost. So there would be more FT and more weakly bound T [albumin+T]. But I cannot see in the abstract any data showing that FT was increased or decreased. Less SHBG also means more free estrogens and that might explain the sexual effects. But perhaps the response of three males with AIDS is not really representative. While it is stated that Oxandrolone is not very liver toxic [most oral T’s are], we have to observe that SHBG is made in the liver to clear estrogens and also clears T. If E2 increases, more SHBG is created to deal with that. Oxandrolone reduces SHBG and perhaps that might be a toxic process.

Thanks for the info KS, this is starting to get too complicated for me:) I’m just going to stay off Oxandrolone and see where my T ends up down the road a couple of months from now,the highest I ever had was 777 with Androgel and Oxandarin, if I get around that range with T Cypionate alone, and I might as it’s much better absorbed than the gel, that would be ideal…one less drug!

“I had surgery not too long ago and they tested thyroid function and pretty much every important test there is.”

get the data, doctors overlook a lot

This a third request to check and post your body temperatures?

Too complicated? It may appear that way. What we are asking you to do is the same as for everyone else. It takes time to understand.

Do you mean just with a thermometer in my mouth? If so I’ll check it later today. I often get a lot of heat build up in my upper chest area, when I was in the hospital I mentioned it to the nurse and she said that since my temp was normal it would not be possible for a part of my body to be above normal, so I asked her to tape one of those disposable temperature strips that you put under your tongue onto my chest and it was normal or just very slightly below normal. I’ve had that for the past 15 years and I once asked a former girlfriend to put her hand on my chest when I was having, I guess for lack of a better way to describe it, a hot flash, it would come and go and much more if the room was warm and without air flow, she thought it was hot. She tended to feel on the cold side (maybe under active thyroid) so she would call me the radiator man and herself the refrigerator girl.

When I go in for my next appointment I’ll ask the front desk to print out my labs for the past 2 years and check my thyroid function.

Thanks and I’ll measure my temp and post it later today.

I just took my temperature (7:15pm) and it was 98 degrees, so I guess that would be considered normal.

Don’t give up read the stickies and other cases.

Absorb the knowledge.

Read the injection sticky specially.

You should get 98.6 during the day. I usually suggest mid afternoon. 98.0 would be a problem

You cannot talking, training, eating, drinking for a while before you take your oral temperature.