Alkaline vs Acidic Diet

I have seen a lot of posts about the problems of acidic diet and thus far they seem poorly substantiated.

I have seen claims that many of us are in a state of mild acidocis and that is complete nonsense.

I have also seen claims that the constant strain to keep our pH correct leaches calcium and more from our bodies etc. I have a hard time believing this one too but I am willing to look at evidence. Does anyone have anything real on this?

I don’t have a very big understand of the chemistry involved, but I was under the impression that the acid buffer for blood is HC03-. It may take some energy to create this molecule from C02 and 02 gasses, but I don’t think there is any calcium or other important nutrients being depleted.

I know exercise increases H+ ions in the blood quite a bit as well. Probably more than any food could.

The important question is:

Can this knowledge be used to transform our physiology so that our blood can be acidic (ala a xenomorph) and possibly be used as a weapon?

As usual I add nothing intelligent to the discussion. But this looks like a pretty dead thread anyway.

Keeping the blood in a mildly alkaline state is necessary for good health. Our body uses tightly regulated mechanisms to do this. A good friend of mine who is a nutritionist, used to be hardcore vegetarian in part for this purpose. (Fruits and veggies are often recommended to keep the blood alkaline.)

However, his pH was all over the place. Very wild and frequent fluctuations. About a year ago he started eating a conventional diet with protein, starch, some fats, and some veggies. He not only packed on a lot more mass, but his pH is consistently slightly alkaline. He suspects, and I’ve read this elsewhere, that protein keeps the pH more stable in the alkaline range. This runs contrary to what you hear from most of the gurus on this subject.

Edit: I forgot to add that he did, I think, an 8-week experiment with two of his clients. One was a raw vegan (raw fruits, veggies, etc.) and the other was a raw animal foodist (nothing but raw meat, raw dairy). The vegan’s pH was highly acidic and fluctuated a lot. The animal foodist had an alkaline pH and was stable. Draw your own conclusions.

How was this guy testing his pH? There is no way his pH was fluctuating that much. It can only change by like 1% or he would be in the hospital. And at that small of a percentage you have to wonder about the accuracy of testing method.

Urine strips. I’m not confident your information is accurate.

[quote]eic wrote:
Urine strips. I’m not confident your information is accurate. [/quote]

Thomas Gabriel is right. Blood pH does not fluctuate. Urine pH is the only thing that does. Fluctuating urine pH is not a problem. it is a sign of a properly functioning body. The bodies job is not to neutralize the pH of everything we eat. Our urine is our method of excreting acid. That is why I am skeptical of all these claims.

I remember reading a paper on how osteoperosis is less common among those who eat lots of fruits and vegetables, supposedly because of the alkaline content:

I googled “study osteoperosis vegetables”
and came up with this, not sure if its the same paper but it may be worth a read-through for the subject:
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/83/6/1254

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0ISW/is_261/ai_n13654013

http://www.oasisadvancedwellness.com/learning/weight-loss-ph-factor.html

http://hubpages.com/hub/Bone_Loss
www.fitcommerce.com/Blueprint/Page.aspx?pageId=594&tabindex=5&review=-1&rrefid=1147

yarchive.net/med/acid_balance.html

There are a few studdies to start with, if you don’t believe me you can pm John Berardi as he will back this up. It should be noted though that it is a quick fix. Just take in enough fruits and vegtables or a T of Potasium Bicarbonate. When people talk about leeching calcium it can be prevented.

The purpose of pointing it out is one of preventative nature and not to be taken as don’t eat high protein etc., simply eat foods with it and take precautions so that you are getting the most out of the nutrients you ar taking in.

Thanks guys. I have got some reading to do.

Edit: Itwas reading something by Berardi that got me thinking about this.

Most of the Acid vs Alkaline commentary on-line is nonsense but the calcium leaching is the only plausible thing I have heard. I am a bit skeptical so I need to dig into it more. I eat my veggies so I think I am ok.

I wonder about all the guys that eat tons of meat and take HCl as taking an acid supplement is counter to taking an alkaline supplement.

[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
Thanks guys. I have got some reading to do.

Edit: Itwas reading something by Berardi that got me thinking about this.

Most of the Acid vs Alkaline commentary on-line is nonsense but the calcium leaching is the only plausible thing I have heard. I am a bit skeptical so I need to dig into it more. I eat my veggies so I think I am ok.

I wonder about all the guys that eat tons of meat and take HCl as taking an acid supplement is counter to taking an alkaline supplement.[/quote]

That is a good point, with HCL supplementation, it is not for everyone. You should do the test before you add it in. You need to have some acid present for digestive purposes, the problem comes when you fall out of the optimum PH range or your net acid load is too great (that is when the calcium thing becomes an issue).

Again, low carb diets are not necessasarily bad, just be sure you get enough fruits and veggies to balance things out or as I suggested the 2 KHCO3.

[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
I have seen a lot of posts about the problems of acidic diet and thus far they seem poorly substantiated.

I have seen claims that many of us are in a state of mild acidocis and that is complete nonsense.

I have also seen claims that the constant strain to keep our pH correct leaches calcium and more from our bodies etc. I have a hard time believing this one too but I am willing to look at evidence. Does anyone have anything real on this?[/quote]

I think this pH issue is mostly a non-issue driven into hysteria by quack alternative health promoters and supplement dealers.

[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
I have seen a lot of posts about the problems of acidic diet and thus far they seem poorly substantiated.

I have seen claims that many of us are in a state of mild acidocis and that is complete nonsense.

I have also seen claims that the constant strain to keep our pH correct leaches calcium and more from our bodies etc. I have a hard time believing this one too but I am willing to look at evidence. Does anyone have anything real on this?

I think this pH issue is mostly a non-issue driven into hysteria by quack alternative health promoters and supplement dealers. [/quote]

Any basis for saying this? Or just speculating because it goes against what people usually do?

[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
I have seen a lot of posts about the problems of acidic diet and thus far they seem poorly substantiated.

I have seen claims that many of us are in a state of mild acidocis and that is complete nonsense.

I have also seen claims that the constant strain to keep our pH correct leaches calcium and more from our bodies etc. I have a hard time believing this one too but I am willing to look at evidence. Does anyone have anything real on this?

I think this pH issue is mostly a non-issue driven into hysteria by quack alternative health promoters and supplement dealers. [/quote]

So what part don’t you agree with? Are you saying blood acid doesn’t matter or Calcium is not a basic compound?

The optimum pH for our blood and body tissues is about 7.2. (The use of saliva and urine test strips will show a much lower pH level due to the protein present in the solution. Saliva and urine tests from a healthy body should be about 6.6 to 6.8.)

Acidosis is a condition of over-acidity in the blood and body tissues. When the body loses its alkaline reserve, pleomorphic virus, bacteria, yeast, and fungus take over and cause degenerative diseases such as, diabetes, cancer, aids, arteriosclerosis, arthritis, osteoporosis, chronic fatigue, etc.

Acidosis may be caused by improper diet, kidney, liver, and adrenal disorders, emotional disturbances, fever, and an excess of niacin, vitamin C, and aspirin.

The body heals best when it is slightly alkaline. To keep the blood and body tissue at an optimum pH, avoid acid forming foods. Make sure your food intake is 80% alkaline and drink plenty of water.

Some alkali-forming foods include dark green and yellow vegetables, sprouted grains, legumes, seeds, nuts, essential fats (omega 3 and 6), and low sugar fruits like avocados and lemons.

You can flavor your water with 1-2 drops of lemon or peppermint oil. Lemon has the ability to counteract acidity in the body. The citric acid found in lemons is neutralized during digestion, giving off carbonates and bicarbonates of potassium and calcium, which helps maintain the alkalinity of the system.

spring or mineral water is probably the best solution for preventing high acidity(structured water).second should be fruits,veggies,nuts and to add only raw.now one of the problems much people fail to get is that burning protein for fuel is a very dirty process.I think that the recent trend to high protein diets should just hurt a lot of people in the long run.

I have seen people mixing egg whites with protein powders and no fat added my friend.Oh yeah they will add some veggies but what the fuck.Im just saying that if you turn your protein into energy youll get dirty(acidic).In general high protein diets should be high in calories.No excuses for the fat guys too :stuck_out_tongue:

Now the solution is to get off the high protein diet for a period of time.So your organs can rest and the next time you overfeed with proteins they should be used as building blocks rather then energy.
Now I know in the moment I`m advocating a protein cycling that lots of people say it is useless but they are just so wrong!

Im not a get big muscle freak.Just a guy who likes to lift heavy have a good defined body and dont take any form of supplements except vit C vit E and eating a raw cod liver :slight_smile:

[quote]bulldogtor wrote:
PRCalDude wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
I have seen a lot of posts about the problems of acidic diet and thus far they seem poorly substantiated.

I have seen claims that many of us are in a state of mild acidocis and that is complete nonsense.

I have also seen claims that the constant strain to keep our pH correct leaches calcium and more from our bodies etc. I have a hard time believing this one too but I am willing to look at evidence. Does anyone have anything real on this?

I think this pH issue is mostly a non-issue driven into hysteria by quack alternative health promoters and supplement dealers.

Any basis for saying this? Or just speculating because it goes against what people usually do?
[/quote]
My basis is that I see this claim made most commonly on alternative health and supplement pushing websites. It helps with the three phase business plan these websites typically employ:

  1. make a claim about a condition and back it up with little or no scientific citations while scaring people with a variety of nonspecific symptoms that supposedly result from this condition.

  2. recommend a supplement to supposedly counteract the effects of this condition.

  3. profit!

Example:

http://www.charlespoliquin.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1095&Itemid=10408

Zinc deficiency is not common is the developed world, given the ubiquity of fortified breakfast cereals and the fact that zinc is in practically everything we commonly eat:

PRCalDude yeah i wonder how people get to drink something like KHCO3HCLCO5K and think its very good for them and it will keep them healthy.oh my god now i know why my grandfather died he just didn`t have the blessing of using modern chemistry.

[quote]laroyal wrote:
PRCalDude wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
I have seen a lot of posts about the problems of acidic diet and thus far they seem poorly substantiated.

I have seen claims that many of us are in a state of mild acidocis and that is complete nonsense.

I have also seen claims that the constant strain to keep our pH correct leaches calcium and more from our bodies etc. I have a hard time believing this one too but I am willing to look at evidence. Does anyone have anything real on this?

I think this pH issue is mostly a non-issue driven into hysteria by quack alternative health promoters and supplement dealers.

So what part don’t you agree with? Are you saying blood acid doesn’t matter or Calcium is not a basic compound?[/quote]

I think he has problems with this type of crap:

[i]

Cold showers make the blood alkaline, while hot showers make the blood acid

Some cells may adapt and instead of dying as normal cells do in a acid environment, they will survive by becoming abnormal. These abnormal cells are known as malignant cells. Malignant cells do not correspond with brain function nor with our DNA memory code. Malignant cells grow indefinitely and without order. This is cancer, and cancer develops in the following stages:

An acid body is a magnet for sickness, disease, cancer and aging. Eating more alkaline foods helps shift your body’s pH and oxygenate your system. Alkaline foods keep your body healthy and functioning correctly, preventing cancer.

[/i]

This is alarmist nonsense. The body tightly regulates blood pH. Respiratory or kidney disease can cause acidocis but the quacks at this website want to reverse the cause and effect.

We need to separate the quackery from the discussion.