T Nation

After Reading All the Newbie Guides...

after reading all of the newbie guides ive come up with a cycle of D-bol, Test,and HCG that looks some thing like this

4 weeks D-bol 30mg/day <— instant results
8 weeks Test 500mg/week <— continued results
10 weeks hcg ?mg/week <— i’ve bee reading i should use not sure how much

2 weeks of Clomid post workout starting 5 days after last injection…

am i missing anything really important wanna get all my facts straight before i start. i threw in arrows as to show what i believe each on of those will do for me… still have a bit of research to do on hcg… cant really find to much on it tho… thanks for constructive criticism

i neglected to add personal stats which a sticky advises so here we go

im 6 foot 175 pounds have not max’d anything since last cycle “scared of injury”

my numbers should look something like this

bench 250
squat 350
deadlift 250 <— form sucks working on it

up till this point ive been using fake gear i got of random websites ive been able to establish a connection got my hands on some test,and dbol… not wanted to waste another cycle i threw up my intended cycle above for critic. My goals are simple i want 320 bench by spring while gaining 20 pounds of lean muscle… once spring hits im taking 6 months off gear to let my body recover. winter=gear time, summer= play time

You’re kind of sort of there, but you’re missing quite a bit of information for us, so apparently there are a few newbie guides you’ve missed (I really wish they would make one for taking the time to use punctuation, proper spelling, and standardized grammar and diction in your first and subsequent posts. It’s kind of like speaking politely to someone the first time you meet them, especially if you are asking that person for advice).

Why 10 weeks of HCG?

Why only 2 weeks of clomid “post workout?” (I assume you mean post cycle)

Why are you starting PCT 5 days after your final injection?

What ester is your test?

I also see nothing at all about stats: age, training age, weight, height, bf% estimate, etc.

EDIT: Your second post came up after mine went through. 175 at 6’ eh…?

I apologize for poor grammar it has never been my strong point. Indeed i am about as green horn as u can get but i’m trying. Its clear to me i need to do more research before my next cycle… alot more research. I will attempt to answer your question to the best of my knowledge. Feel free to flame when my logic is flawed/

Why 10 weeks of HCG?
From what i read HCG should be used both during your cycle, and post cycle using it for 10 weeks would cover both fronts

Why only 2 weeks of clomid “post workout?” (I assume you mean post cycle)
Also going off what i read in the stickies if i use HCG in my cycle only 2 weeks of clomid is needed.

Why are you starting PCT 5 days after your final injection?
is there a better time to start it? From what i was reading 5 days is the correct time to start PCT

What ester is your test?
This i do not know. will attempt to find out

I also see nothing at all about stats: age, training age, weight, height, bf% estimate, etc.
Age 20, Training age 3, Weight 175, height 6 foot 1, BF% 10%,

You aren’t developed enough to need steroids at your age. Get to 200lbs naturally sub 12%bf. Seriously 175 at 6’1 means you dont eat enough. That’s rediculously light. Or if you do eat enough and gain too much fat you don’t train properly or hard enough. You’ve been lifting for three damn years and you think you are ready for steroids? Please

You also need to do plenty more research. It seems like you’ve read stuff from one place. That place has given you questionable information, at best.

It will be in your best interest to get in proper physical condition and collect enough good information before you inject anything. If choose not to then expect to lose all of your gains during ‘summer play time’.

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
You aren’t developed enough to need steroids at your age. Get to 200lbs naturally sub 12%bf. Seriously 175 at 6’1 means you dont eat enough. That’s rediculously light. Or if you do eat enough and gain too much fat you don’t train properly or hard enough. You’ve been lifting for three damn years and you think you are ready for steroids? Please

You also need to do plenty more research. It seems like you’ve read stuff from one place. That place has given you questionable information, at best.

It will be in your best interest to get in proper physical condition and collect enough good information before you inject anything. If choose not to then expect to lose all of your gains during ‘summer play time’. [/quote]

I have to agree with this. Not much to add other than that I think that there’s really no good reason for anyone under 25 years old to be using steroids in 98% of cases. You certainly are NOT in that 2%, I am sorry to say.

That’s not to say you shouldn’t keep at it. Just don’t blow your load this early. It will be a major waste and you will really regret it.

For the record, I didn’t start until after I was 30, so I walk the walk :wink:

i understand my age/weight is not ideal. Ive been lifting weights for 3 years now and i have gained a total of 3 lbs naturally seriously all i do is cut fat. I’ve followed every workout plan i could find next to 0 results “apart from cutting down to like 5% BF” i eat a TON of healthy food chicken/pork, seafood, tons of veg’s i drink protein shakes to keep my protein intake on par with 1.5g/lb.

I eat 5 full meals a day like clockwork 8 am, 11am 1 pm 4 pm 7 pm and i’ve been doing that for 3 year… i did a cycle of shit i got of the web and gained 20 pounds in a 8 week cycle and kept almost 15 post cycle. that was 8 weeks ago and i have yet to gain another pound… i’ve simple maintained the strength/size i got. i work my ass off in the gym every day.

I’m not saying i’m a perfect candidate for gear but i am saying i am doing them my next cycle starts January 11th i simply want to get the best out of my cycle i understand the side effects and am willing to live with them. Tho i am hoping to minimize them “who isnt” through helpful advise/criticism. Telling me not to do it is like telling an emo kid with a knife in his hand “dont cut you will be fine” then leaving the room.

The only thing constructive thing i’ve taken out of this post is “your almost there” please what am i missing in this cycle to make it complete. Criticize my cycle whats it missing? Through personal experiences what kind of things should i expect with this particular combo. i’ve never done a cycle of real gear i want this one to be as informed as it can be. Ill keep reading but i think i’ve gotten to the “trail and error” point where i am just have at it.

p.s out of respect for this community ive put a great deal of effort into the grammar in this wall of text

So 175lbs is your weight AFTER you’ve done a cycle.

This is a joke.

Learn how to fucking eat.

As a fellow user who started young, I also do not think you are ready.

[quote]DOHCrazy wrote:
As a fellow user who started young, I also do not think you are ready.[/quote]

I started young, as well and I don’t think you’re ready, either.

Take bonez’s advice and learn how to eat.

Yea a lot of us started young. I regret how young I started. But the age is almost irrelevant when talking about a person that started using steroids at 6’1 ~160lbs.

eh. i wont argue that i eat enough… seems to be alot of “we arnt helping unless u meet are standards” on these forums so fuck it. i can figure it out through trial and error.

It’s because the gear isn’t the problem. You have to realize that we actually do know what we are talking about, otherwise our advice is meaningless in the first place. You cannot isolate one element and put it on a pedestal.

You will probably continue to make gains using gear off the next cycle or two, but there are other elements that are MORE necessary than drugs, and you WILL eventually stall out for good. Food is WAY lower down on the pyramid, and you said yourself that you spend most of your time on cutting diets and eating “healthy” food. Well there’s your problem right there. It’s right in front of your face, people are telling you, you said it yourself, but because you are not hearing what you want to hear, you are going off in a huff. Well, you can get as angry at all us (who, not incidentally, all happen to be a lot bigger than you) as you want, but it is still not going to change actual reality. And actual reality is that big bodies require big calories. They require a lot more than tuna and chicken breasts. Save the cutting diet for a bodybuilding show three to five years from now. You need to be eating steaks and cheeseburgers.

For reference. I helped a guy, who was in a similar position as yourself, put on around 12lbs of almost completely fat free mass BEFORE starting his first cycle when he’d been determined to start a cycle right away. We did this just by conscientiously increasing his calories. He then went on to more than double that weight when he did start his cycle. I guarantee the weight he gained on cycle would have been the same, either way, but because he learned to eat FIRST, he both gained more mass first, and he will KEEP that mass afterward.

I hope I’m not wasting my words. If I hear any more suggestions about how the only way you are going to be able to gain weight is through gear I am going to stop offering any more advice, period. Calories have to go somewhere. They have to.

[quote]jwandoj wrote:
eh. i wont argue that i eat enough… seems to be alot of “we arnt helping unless u meet are standards” on these forums so fuck it. i can figure it out through trial and error.[/quote]

Why don’t you take yourself to the beginners forum and post your routine and diet plan for people to critique. 3lbs of muscle in 3 years???!!! clearly you’re doing something wrong.

Edit: and they are helping you by saying you don’t need steroids you just need to know how to train.

[quote]jwandoj wrote:
i can figure it out through trial and error.[/quote]

AAAAGH!

Dude! No! Just fucking no!

jesus fucking christ

[quote]jwandoj wrote:
i can figure it out through trial and error.[/quote]

I don’t even take roids and I know thats a bad idea LOLOL.