T Nation

After My First Year of TRT...


#1

1 full year of TRT. What a lot of changes have happened.

My build has changed significantly with no change in routine. My mood and outlook are better. My beard has filled in. My libido is off the top of the scale.

I'm glad I found this place and thanks to everybody for all the help.


#2

Right on!

Glad you got TRT working for you. It's great when it's tuned just right.

Happy New Year!

BD


#3

Glad to hear it, happy new year!


#4

I've been on HRT for 8 months..........did you notice any additional improvement between months 9 and 12?


#5

That seems to be when the body changes really started. It is like it takes a period of time for all of the T receptors to get saturated again.

I just had labs drawn Wednesday and will publish them when I get them. 7 tubes worth (cbc, liver panel, thyroid panel, total T, E, lipids with sub types, ....).


#6

Thanks, may I ask you a few more questions?

If you take arimidex..........did you have to increase the dosage after some period of time?

Did you notice any mood or mental clarity gains during months 9 thru 12?

So far, I've been very impressed with HRT. Congrats on your progress.


#7

Gary,

Glad to hear the good news! Happy New Year too.
I have been on HRT for 2-1/2 years, and didn't really get all the benefits until I got my adex dosage dialed in. Now libido and drive in the gym are better than ever, and I don't have to be quite so careful about how many carbs I eat.

I eat a clean diet, but was afraid of too many carbs PWO in the past, but now I pretty much eat as many as I want (within reason) and I don't start fattening up. Carbs had always been a problem and now they're not.

I used to use the liquid adex and had positive blood work results, but not too many physically. I have a script for the tabs and now take 2-1/4 (mg's) a week and life is really good.

I take HCG along with my T-Cyp shots along with a few herbs, and not only do I feel great, but my b/w always shows off the scale high Free T, and low 20's E2.


#8

I have not had to do arimidex yet. My E has fluctuated between 20 and 30. I am taking 300mg of grape seed extract. So my total supplement stack is multi-vitamin, fish oil (5g/day), and 300 mg grape seed.

My last test had E at 30 and IGF off the chart. T3 and T4 are well within normal ranges. LH was low, but haven't seen any atrophy or had pain. My T was about the 75th percentile. The scale on the test was 0-800 and it was about 580.

Get this blood work back on Wednesday. Felt like a vampire had at me this time.

As far as mood during months 9-12, it has been great. Probably too good. During the last quarter of this year we have lost all of our remaining grand-parents and my wife has breast cancer. But yet, I am dealing with all of it while keeping a busy schedule. A year ago I don't know if I could have dealt with all of that so quickly.

I can say that several months into HRT I had to reduce my anti-depressants by 1/3, which was a huge deal to my self esteem. The afternoon dose was making me manic, too manic, giggly, talkative, .... Now I'm down to 1 wellbutrin in the morning and 1 effexor in the evening.


#9

Thanks for the report.


#10

Gary,
Glad to hear you have cut back on the anti-depressants. Reduction of psych meds is always a huge step forward. Please post your b/w results when you get them okay?


#11

Nice to hear good news on this subject. What form have you been using for TRT? Shots, compounds, gels? I am just starting out and think I may need to find a new doctor who is a bit more up to date on the subject.

Thanks.


#12

Thanks for the info Gary. Keep us posted on your progress.


#13

Dr. Crisler puts the gel at the number one choice, followed by shots. Compounded is cheaper than androgel if your insurance will cover the compounded.


#14

Labs (LabCorp):

T-Total 714 ng/dL (RefRange 241-827)
TSH 1.728 (0.450 - 4.500)
SHBG 18 nmol/L (13 - 71)
T3 118 ng/dL (85 - 205)
T4 1.03 ng/dL (0.61 - 1.76)
Albumin 4.4 g/dL (3.5 - 5.5)

Free T calculates at 20.8 ng/dL = 2.92 %

Surprises:

Estrone 62 pg/mL (12 - 72)
Creatinine 1.29 mg/dL (RefRange 0.76 - 1.27)

We are taking the injections to ETD to see if that affects the estrone number.


#15

Gary,
Thanks for posting the b/w results. Everything looks good except the Estrone and Creatinine, and unless you eat a really high protein diet, then the only problem left is the Estrone. Although Estrone is the Estrogen found predominately in fat cells as opposed to normal, "circulating" Estrogen metabolites, the answer is still the same; you're way too high to be "happy". Too much Estrogen of anykind may produce depression like symptoms in males, so as your doc suggested you need to lower your E2 levels.
I do have a question though: by making your T doses smaller and more frequent, theoretically your E2 problems should resolve themselves...?
But, the important question is what do you do to get your levels down in the meantime? And what if you now have enough Estrone stored in your body fat to keep your levels too high anyway?
That is the possible dilemma you face. You say you've been taking a grape skin product, something similar to Resveratrol, I'll guess?
Your body doesn't seem to be making use of it, or without it your E numbers would really be sky-high. It now seems time to pull out the big guns and try adex. As I have said before, the QOL improvement is almost unbelievable with good, healthy, moderate E numbers versus high E numbers.
When my E numbers were in the 60's I felt like crap, and didn't even "enjoy" sex. With my E in the low 20's, I constantly chase my g/f into the bedroom, and she's not complaining either.(lucky me) Oh, and sex is as good as when I was in my 20's again too!


#16

KNB thanks for the reply.

Oh, if only my wife liked it that much. But she is going through a hard time right now -- breast cancer, which means I'm going to be crawling up the walls.

I will have more blood work in 6 weeks. If E is still high, then he will start an AI.


#17

Glad to hear you're doing well for yourself and well wishes to your wife. It seems odd that after a year of consistently landing between 20-30, that your E has spiked now. Is this typical for it to take this long for it to adjust?


#18

Gary,

That estrone number is pointeless. It is a test based for women and has little merit.

You specifically want the ultra sensitive estradiol test(E2)


#19

Wise Guy and GaryC,
I both agree and disagree about the Estrone test as I mentioned earlier. True, the Ultra Sensitive Estradiol Test for Men is way more accurate in terms or "real" numbers, but I believe the Estrone results tell you something you didn't think of before; the potential for the storage of the Aromitase Enzyme that converts T into E2.

We know about fat storage of both the Enzyme and E2 as being real so the test wasn't completely wasted, just not the optimum test to have.
If you can convince the doctor to run the Ultra Sensitive next time, and your numbers aren't below 15 (range 0 <29) then an AI is likely in you future. With insurance Adex is way cheaper than buying Resveratrol anyway...


#20

Which lab do you use for the E2 assay? My doc uses labcorp by default. It looks like labcorp only has estrogen test.