Yes...tapering as per the Underground Steroid Handbook, Circa 1980-something...has been largely discredited by most current authors in that field.
And..."all" in the context we typically speak. All injectable (suppressive) steroids, is actually what I mean.
Remember, we're talking about faster recovery here. If you taper for 4 weeks, and eventually get to that small amount left in your body (via tapering)- you're still behind the guy who went cold turkey and has none left in half the time right?
If you aren't gaining, and you aren't recovering, then youre wasting time. I feel tapering won't allow you to recover at all, until you're actually off.
No...thats not really what I think...I believe that the suppressive steroids have to be totally gone, more or less...or nearly so.
This is easily addressed and refuted in my PCT article.
The leydig cell desensitizing nature and suppressive nature of HCG is largely do to 17OHP and other factors addressed and rectified within the confines of my PCT...Nolvadex, here is the answer...quoting from my PCT article:
"But are we still risking some inhibition and possibly delaying our recovery by using HCG? Probably not?you see, some studies in humans have shown that HCG does not actually have a direct effect on inhibiting LH release in men (22)(23), but rather (probably) works to inhibit LH secretion indirectly, simply by stimulating the production of testosterone (thus activating the negative feedback loop). Another factor involved is the induction of testicular aromatase, which raises estrogen levels, again causing inhibition. Unfortunately, yet another process, the downregulation of the Leydig Cell LH receptor itself, seems to also play a role in high dose HCG testicular desensitization. This is also done by HCG actually blocking the conversion of 17 alpha-hydroxyprogesterone (17 OHP) to testosterone (24). Nolvadex actually stops this blocking-action of HCG from taking place (25). Most likely, because of Nolvadex?s direct antiestrogenic effect and LH-upregulating effect on the Pituitary, suppression of gonadotropins via HCG is (25) almost totally stopped with concurrent administration of Nolvadex"
- J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1989 Jul;69(1):170-6.
- Eur J Endocrinol. 1997 Apr;136(4):438-43.
- Andrologia 1991 Mar-Apr;23(2):109-14
If this is not the case, then why not? I've made a very strong argument for Nolvadex & Aromasin being used with HCG to stop- it's suppressive nature. Why won't that work? References? I've been good enough to support my argument in my own PCT, fully referenced, above. If you want to refute that case, at least be courteous enough to respond in kind, fully referenced.
Not the same thing. We're trying to keep gains, not simply restore hormonal function. We want to keep gains fro mthe cycle...cessation of AAS therapy in a healthy male will allow full recovery eventually- and a loss of most gains. Thats not what we're looking for.
I used to taper. Why would you think I haven't tried that?
I used to do clomid therapy too.
I basically did most of the stuff you talk about...remember, the idea of tapering and using some clomid and HCG has been around since the 80's...I've tried it. I feel it to be inferior to my methods, based on observing the results I've seen in the people who I put on my version of PCT.
Of course I've tried tapering, and the protocol you reccomend...it is Duchaine's from the USH1 and 2, almost verbatim.
I've tried everything he wrote on, just about.
I don't really go off now, so I can't try my own PCT method for awhile...but the bodybuilders who have tried it have all had success with it, over anything else they have tried...so have the members of alot of different boards I've read...