Adding 15 lbs to Bench in 6 wks

Bigger Stronger Leaner Powerlifting & Strength Sports
21

[quote]StrengthDawg wrote:
conorh wrote:
Why are you doing a bunch of singles if you’re bench is that low? I’m guessing there’s probably not a big gap between your 1 rep max and your 5 rep, so might as well get some reps in.

I don’t think he is currently doing alot of singles. Here’s what he said he was doing…

I’ve been on the Texas Method where you do a 5x5(bench) monday, a 3x3(press) wed, and shoot for a PR(bench) on friday. While this has worked for a while, I’ve stalled pretty good and now I don’t know what to do since time is so short

He’s getting alot of advice to do singles in preparation for his meet which is less than 6 weeks away. Now what he’s doing volume wise on that Friday where he shoots for a PR hasn’t been discussed.[/quote]

If he’s doing singles, especially with pauses as “form work”, to get ready for the meet I think that’s probably fine.

22

[quote]Modi wrote:
dankid wrote:
***The singles are the most important part of everything IMO. If you start with 195 and do 5-10 singles per session, and add 5lbs per week, that will put you at ABOVE 225 in 6 weeks.

I really like this advice. You should hit 225 no problem at your next meet. After the meet keep adding 5lbs a week, and then plan for a meet around March where you should be Benching close to 315. By this time next year, you will be well over the 400lb mark. :wink:

Seriously, if 225 is the most important goal at this meet, then I would focus on technique and weight gain leading up to the meet.

Post a video of your successful 210 lift, and a video of one of your heavier misses and we might be able to give some better pointers.

With only six weeks left until the meet, you really only have 4 weeks left to focuse on strength gains, and then you will need to start your taper. But if we find a glaring weakness/technique issue, we might be able to get you that 15lbs a lot easier.

[/quote]

I like your enthusiasm, but I dont know about putting nearly 200lbs (doubling) his bench in a year. Its a good idea to aim high, but more importantly he’s gotta get his technique right in the first place.

Also, I dont think he’ll need much of a taper. At these strength levels, he should be able to train right up to the competition, and take 1 light workout before the actual event.

23

[quote]conorh wrote:
Why are you doing a bunch of singles if you’re bench is that low? I’m guessing there’s probably not a big gap between your 1 rep max and your 5 rep, so might as well get some reps in.[/quote]

Im not really sure you have an opinion here, because your next comment says if he’s doing singles with a pause then he’s on the right track?

Sure he could do sets of 5 with 175 or so, and get volume in, but his form would probably go to hell, and he wouldn’t get the technique work that is so important to him. Also, 175 is much less than 225, as opposed to using 195-200 for singles and focusing on technique. Within a few weeks he’ll be doing a bunch of singles with 210-220. At that point he should have no problem popping up 225.

24

[quote]StrengthDawg wrote:
Now what he’s doing volume wise on that Friday where he shoots for a PR hasn’t been discussed.[/quote]

I actually discussed this above, and suggested he scrap this work. There is pretty much no benefit at his strength level to shoot for a PR every week. This means you are only getting one rep, which means less practice, and less volume. If you think about it, what is better for strength: doing 1x210 as a max, or 10x1x200?

Much further on down the road, when a max single gets to be demanding he can shoot for a PR and then use accessory work to get his volume in.

25

I strongly agree with all of the people who suggested you improve your technique.

Make sure you’re arching your lower back, “setting” your shoulderblades by pinching them together, keeping your elbows tucked (not flared out to the sides), and driving through the legs.

You may also benefit from training your bench from your sticking point. For example, if you can get the bar off your chest, but you always miss it eight inches from lockout, try a four-board press. If you miss off the chest and are competing raw (which I assume you are), paused bench might be the way to go. I would advise only pausing as long as you will in competition. Try practicing your bench with someone giving you commands to press and rack. In my first powerlifting meet, I missed my bench opener because I racked it before the command.

It’s also possible that you have sufficient pushing strength in your chest, shoulders, and triceps, and that your limiting factor is your ability to stabilize your shoulderblades. Doing lots of scapular stability and pulling movements would help a lot if that was the case.

26

[quote]dankid wrote:
conorh wrote:
Why are you doing a bunch of singles if you’re bench is that low? I’m guessing there’s probably not a big gap between your 1 rep max and your 5 rep, so might as well get some reps in.

Im not really sure you have an opinion here, because your next comment says if he’s doing singles with a pause then he’s on the right track?

Sure he could do sets of 5 with 175 or so, and get volume in, but his form would probably go to hell, and he wouldn’t get the technique work that is so important to him. Also, 175 is much less than 225, as opposed to using 195-200 for singles and focusing on technique. Within a few weeks he’ll be doing a bunch of singles with 210-220. At that point he should have no problem popping up 225.[/quote]

In skimming the comments I understand there to be suggestions he start doing more singles as work sets, the typical ME 90% recommendation type stuff. I think this is asinine for someone who benches 225. OTOH, if he’s getting ready for the meet and using this as form work IN ADDITION to regular higher volume work, I think that’s fine.

I just don’t want the OP to start doing an “ME day” and getting in “3-10 lifts at or above 90% of max” because he’s just not advanced enough for that method. He just needs to lift weights.

27

[quote]dankid wrote:
StrengthDawg wrote:
Now what he’s doing volume wise on that Friday where he shoots for a PR hasn’t been discussed.

I actually discussed this above, and suggested he scrap this work. There is pretty much no benefit at his strength level to shoot for a PR every week. This means you are only getting one rep, which means less practice, and less volume. If you think about it, what is better for strength: doing 1x210 as a max, or 10x1x200?

Much further on down the road, when a max single gets to be demanding he can shoot for a PR and then use accessory work to get his volume in.[/quote]

That’s great that YOU discussed it but the OP ELANO hasn’t specified how much volume HE does on his Friday. That’s what I meant.
Strength Levels are RELATIVE that’s why a typical West Side split will work for everyone because you are using a percentage of your 1RM. As you know the West Side model calls for, on ME day, to work up to around 3 maybe 4 sets at or above 90%.

So what you’ve suggested is that this guy do 300% more work than a system that has proven itself over and over? Sure you wouldn’t want to throw up 210 AND CALL IT QUITS BUT that’s too much volume he’ll fry his CNS and won’t be able to push shit come meet time.

28

Being that 210 is pretty light respectively, I don;t think you would have much of a problem getting 225 in 6 weeks.

If you were me, I’d decrease the weight on all my working sets and do more reps, adding 5 pounds per session until you can get 210 x 3 or so which would put your max around 225. You’re also using weights that would allow you to hit bench pretty hard twice a week without having to worry as much about recovery as say someone benching 400…

Keep hammering away once you get ahold of technique and a decent program your bench should definetly increase a lot.

29

Wow, I’m impressed with a lot of the advice and I am really thankful that yall are helping me.
I tried the Dave Tate technique monday and wow did it make a big difference.

The program I have been following for a year is:

-Monday-
5x5 back squat
5x5 bench press
5x5 powerclean or bb row
3x5 dips
3x5 chinups

-Wednesday-
3x3 front squat
3x3 press
3x3 power clean or bb row
5x5 curls
3x20 calf raise

-friday-
1rm, 2rm,3rm OR 5rm on the squat, bench, and deadlift for a single set
Latly I’ve been doind 2rm and 1rm work on this day

There is a really strong guy in my gym who benches in the 300s. I talked with about my situation and he wrote me up a program that looks like this:

-Monday-
4x3 Reverse deadlifts (I don’t know if this is a good idea, he says he has a hunch)
5-4-3-2-1 Bench Press
3x8 Incline dumbell press
3x5 Weighted dips leaning forward

-Wednesday-
5-4-3-2-1 Power cleans with 5 and 4 being warmup sets and 3-2-1 being max effort

-Thursday-
3x5 Close grip bench
3x10 Straight bar cable pulldown as heavy as I can go with good form

-Friday-
4x3 Squat
2x6 Explosive squat using 1/2 the weight
4x3 Rack pulls from the pins at the knee

What do yall think about this? He said he was going to give me another bench routine in 2 weeks.

30

[quote]conorh wrote:
dankid wrote:
conorh wrote:
Why are you doing a bunch of singles if you’re bench is that low? I’m guessing there’s probably not a big gap between your 1 rep max and your 5 rep, so might as well get some reps in.

Im not really sure you have an opinion here, because your next comment says if he’s doing singles with a pause then he’s on the right track?

Sure he could do sets of 5 with 175 or so, and get volume in, but his form would probably go to hell, and he wouldn’t get the technique work that is so important to him. Also, 175 is much less than 225, as opposed to using 195-200 for singles and focusing on technique. Within a few weeks he’ll be doing a bunch of singles with 210-220. At that point he should have no problem popping up 225.

In skimming the comments I understand there to be suggestions he start doing more singles as work sets, the typical ME 90% recommendation type stuff. I think this is asinine for someone who benches 225. OTOH, if he’s getting ready for the meet and using this as form work IN ADDITION to regular higher volume work, I think that’s fine.

I just don’t want the OP to start doing an “ME day” and getting in “3-10 lifts at or above 90% of max” because he’s just not advanced enough for that method. He just needs to lift weights.[/quote]

Completely dumb comment. Sorry, it is. I dont care how advanced someone is, if they are training for an even that revolves around getting the most weight up for a single, then their training better revolve around singles. What the hell does “he just needs to lift weights” mean? Isn’t lifting 90% for singles lifting weights.

IMO, he’d benefit from something like Rippetoe’s, 5x5, 3x3, or westside and just cutting the frequency down to 2x per week and focusing more on just basic benching. BUT! With just 6 weeks, he needs to be prepping for the copmetition, not focusing on long term strength gains. I guess it could also depend on how important this comp. is to him and how much he wants to hit 225. IMO he should just stick with the low volume stuff focusing on technique and getting his bench number up for the competition. Then after the competition adapt a more long term strength building program.

31

[quote]dankid wrote:
conorh wrote:
dankid wrote:
conorh wrote:
Why are you doing a bunch of singles if you’re bench is that low? I’m guessing there’s probably not a big gap between your 1 rep max and your 5 rep, so might as well get some reps in.

Im not really sure you have an opinion here, because your next comment says if he’s doing singles with a pause then he’s on the right track?

Sure he could do sets of 5 with 175 or so, and get volume in, but his form would probably go to hell, and he wouldn’t get the technique work that is so important to him. Also, 175 is much less than 225, as opposed to using 195-200 for singles and focusing on technique. Within a few weeks he’ll be doing a bunch of singles with 210-220. At that point he should have no problem popping up 225.

In skimming the comments I understand there to be suggestions he start doing more singles as work sets, the typical ME 90% recommendation type stuff. I think this is asinine for someone who benches 225. OTOH, if he’s getting ready for the meet and using this as form work IN ADDITION to regular higher volume work, I think that’s fine.

I just don’t want the OP to start doing an “ME day” and getting in “3-10 lifts at or above 90% of max” because he’s just not advanced enough for that method. He just needs to lift weights.

Completely dumb comment. Sorry, it is. I dont care how advanced someone is, if they are training for an even that revolves around getting the most weight up for a single, then their training better revolve around singles. What the hell does “he just needs to lift weights” mean? Isn’t lifting 90% for singles lifting weights.

IMO, he’d benefit from something like Rippetoe’s, 5x5, 3x3, or westside and just cutting the frequency down to 2x per week and focusing more on just basic benching. BUT! With just 6 weeks, he needs to be prepping for the copmetition, not focusing on long term strength gains. I guess it could also depend on how important this comp. is to him and how much he wants to hit 225. IMO he should just stick with the low volume stuff focusing on technique and getting his bench number up for the competition. Then after the competition adapt a more long term strength building program.[/quote]

From personal experience singles kept my bench plateaued for months when doing them. I think mixing it up is the best, some weeks 6-8 reps, others 2-5, rarely do I hit singles and my primary focus at the moment on benching is to get stronger and I’ve gotten a lot stronger, these past 6-8 months on the bench, tightening up my form as well.

He should probably be able to knock out a good 8 reps on 175 if his max is 210. When I get stuck I drop the weight and build back up the previous weights I was using but obviously doing them with more reps. If he starts at 175, and increases the weight 5 pounds per week for 6 weeks I’m sure he’ll knock back some reps with 205 and have that 225 bench. When I hit singles, like I said eralier, every session, my max stayed the same…I went for a good couple of months adding 5 pounds onto my bench for the same number of reps every 2 weeks doing what I just talked about, I think Febuary I was around 300 x 4 and now 350 x 3, yeah one rep less but still.

32

[quote]StrengthDawg wrote:

That’s great that YOU discussed it but the OP ELANO hasn’t specified how much volume HE does on his Friday. That’s what I meant.

[/quote]

Sorry I misunderstood you. Im pretty sure he is shooting for a 1RM PR on fridays and thats it as far benching goes.

As for the volume with 90%. Its great that you can appreciate somethign like westside being relative and that even beginners can use it. I wish others around here would accept that fact.

But I think CNS fatigue and overtraining is much less of an issue when you aren’t strong. Sure 90% is 90% but the load on your system is definately different. If you were to take someone that was a relative beginner who could bench say 150. And someone that could bench 500, you’d better believe that the 500lb bencher would be able to perform less reps with 90% of their max, and would take much longer to recover than the 150lb bencher.

Here is the system ive been using. Ive only been doing it for a few weeks, and haven’t tested my max, but have gotten stronger for sure.

My max was 255 -

ME bench (225) 9 total reps

1st workout it was pretty much 9 singles
2nd workout it was a couple of doubles and singles (something like 2,2,2,1,1,1)
3rd workout it was 3x3

I set it up so that when I can get all 9 reps in 3 sets or less, i increase the weight.

Last workout was 235 (2,2,2,2,1)

So i’ll likely hit 3x3 on the next workout and be upping the weight to 245 or 240.

I’ll admit, it is intense, and you have to keep an eye on recovery, but even if I have to deload every 3-5 weeks, or switch the exercises up, its still giving me better gains than I got while just building up to a max single or triple. Its also not really 90% each week IMO. Because when you first start its 90% and then the next week you are stronger, so it might be 88% or something like that. This is not a big deal, but its actually potentially a little better than always maxing, because the intensity is cycled.

33

This is far from correct.

34

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
dankid wrote:I dont care how advanced someone is, if they are training for an even that revolves around getting the most weight up for a single, then their training better revolve around singles.

This is far from correct.[/quote]

Ok so most powerlifters and weightlifters are training wrong by doing mainly singles, doubles and triples?

35

[quote]dankid wrote:
StrengthDawg wrote:

That’s great that YOU discussed it but the OP ELANO hasn’t specified how much volume HE does on his Friday. That’s what I meant.

Sorry I misunderstood you. Im pretty sure he is shooting for a 1RM PR on fridays and thats it as far benching goes.

As for the volume with 90%. Its great that you can appreciate somethign like westside being relative and that even beginners can use it. I wish others around here would accept that fact.

But I think CNS fatigue and overtraining is much less of an issue when you aren’t strong. Sure 90% is 90% but the load on your system is definately different. If you were to take someone that was a relative beginner who could bench say 150. And someone that could bench 500, you’d better believe that the 500lb bencher would be able to perform less reps with 90% of their max, and would take much longer to recover than the 150lb bencher.

Here is the system ive been using. Ive only been doing it for a few weeks, and haven’t tested my max, but have gotten stronger for sure.

My max was 255 -

ME bench (225) 9 total reps

1st workout it was pretty much 9 singles
2nd workout it was a couple of doubles and singles (something like 2,2,2,1,1,1)
3rd workout it was 3x3

I set it up so that when I can get all 9 reps in 3 sets or less, i increase the weight.

Last workout was 235 (2,2,2,2,1)

So i’ll likely hit 3x3 on the next workout and be upping the weight to 245 or 240.

I’ll admit, it is intense, and you have to keep an eye on recovery, but even if I have to deload every 3-5 weeks, or switch the exercises up, its still giving me better gains than I got while just building up to a max single or triple. Its also not really 90% each week IMO. Because when you first start its 90% and then the next week you are stronger, so it might be 88% or something like that. This is not a big deal, but its actually potentially a little better than always maxing, because the intensity is cycled.

[/quote]

I’m sorry dude, I’ve just had nothing but failure from doing that kind of routine. Really low rep days are great, but not every session and, what kind of results have you achieved because a 255 bench is not much better than the OP’s, which goes to say maybe you need to reavulate your method. No offense of course, just saying. Obviously if your getting great results keep doing it but shitt, that ain’t working for a lot of people.

36

[quote]dankid wrote:
Stronghold wrote:
dankid wrote:I dont care how advanced someone is, if they are training for an even that revolves around getting the most weight up for a single, then their training better revolve around singles.

This is far from correct.

Ok so most powerlifters and weightlifters are training wrong by doing mainly singles, doubles and triples?[/quote]

You don’t know what the fuck you are talking about. “Most powerlifters and weightlifters” are using volume/load progressions of some sort in their training, not hitting max singles 50 weeks out of the year and hoping to magically get stronger.

37

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
dankid wrote:
Stronghold wrote:
dankid wrote:I dont care how advanced someone is, if they are training for an even that revolves around getting the most weight up for a single, then their training better revolve around singles.

This is far from correct.

Ok so most powerlifters and weightlifters are training wrong by doing mainly singles, doubles and triples?

You don’t know what the fuck you are talking about. “Most powerlifters and weightlifters” are using volume/load progressions of some sort in their training, not hitting max singles 50 weeks out of the year and hoping to magically get stronger.[/quote]

Hit the nail on the head bud.

38

[quote]austin_bicep wrote:

I’m sorry dude, I’ve just had nothing but failure from doing that kind of routine. Really low rep days are great, but not every session and, what kind of results have you achieved because a 255 bench is not much better than the OP’s, which goes to say maybe you need to reavulate your method. No offense of course, just saying. Obviously if your getting great results keep doing it but shitt, that ain’t working for a lot of people.[/quote]

Im not doing this every session. I train bench two sessions per week, one focused on heavier weights and singles, doubles, and triples (this method) And the other is lighter weights and higher volume(similar to DE or 5x5)

Some people dont seem to do well with singles. I think it has something to do with them pushing themselves too hard or possibly just poor recovery. But it seems to be working for me, and I like it, so im sticking with it.

I like training concurrently so this is how I set it up, but if I was periodizing it, I would do it similar to Sheiko which happens to range from about 1-5 reps, but does have a lot of volume.

And im also only training one main lift per workout (bench, squat or deadlift) And then I train my accessory stuff with 5-15 reps.

39

[quote]Stronghold wrote:

You don’t know what the fuck you are talking about. “Most powerlifters and weightlifters” are using volume/load progressions of some sort in their training, not hitting max singles 50 weeks out of the year and hoping to magically get stronger.[/quote]

That may be, but they probably are still hitting singles, doubles and triples. I mean when was the last time you saw a weightlifter do a set of 10 on clean an jerk?

Westsides DE method is volume, but uses low reps (1,2,3) And there are progressions and cycles here.

Sheiko is a volume method that uses low reps.

Im sorry Bro, I dont care how strong you think you are, or how weak you think I am; YOU ARE A FUCKING IDIOT, with poor ass reasoning skills.

In a sport like powerlifting or weightlifting where technique is highly important, the number of reps per set should be kept low, regarldess of the volume and intensity.

40

Sorry to interrupt the discussion, but can someone please give me feedback on the routine I posted above and tell me if you think I should do this? It was written for me by a strong dude in my gym who knows I only have 6 weeks left.