T Nation

Accurate Lab Values while on Test Cyp?

I am currently dosing 50mg T cyp every 3.5 days. Will this produce steady state levels or am I getting a trough before each injection?

The reason I ask is that I am trying to figure out when to draw my first set of labs. I want to know on average what 100mg/week is doing to my Testosterone levels. I am a big dude (6’6", 225) so I have a feeling that 100mg may not cut it.

Also…I have heard that it takes about 5-6 weeks for T cyp to build up in one’s body. Is this true?

Plasma levels hit in 5-6 weeks and would not touch and AI until after first blood test. I know 250 lbs -300 lbs people that do fine on 100 mgs of a week with 250 ius HCG 2 times a week. There may be other factors that may be at play that way your testoseterone is not working such as adrenals or thyroid. If you adrenals are shot then thyroid will not work optimally and will not complement TRT. I have ran in to guy my self included with optimal HRT levels and blown adrenals still feeling like crap.

Once adrenals where replenished then I began to feel better immediately. I wish Dr’s would have listen to me while I was telling them about adrenals because I probably would not have to be on TRT if they did. So as stated before if you still feel like crap with optimal T and E levels then you have to go back to square one (adrenals and/or thyroid).

Some peoople prematurely jump to TRT as the cure all without looking at exploring other factors. Pmgamer start 3 every 3 day shots then I was doing biweekly and told this was all wrong. Next thing you know all top names who in business are adopting it. Blood shoud be taken on morning of injection 5 weeks after it begins. The dr could have given you a jump start 200 mgs blast off the bat, but some times better off starting slower and steady

Alright… July 16th I will get the labs. If not in upper quartile for Free T, then adjust dosage upwards.

How do you propose “replenishing” the adrenal glands? I don’t think cortef is the answer. That’s like trying to restore natural testosterone levels by giving someone semi-replacement testosterone shots.

Do the lab 1/2 between injections. The levels are changing to some extent.

I think that serum T levels get steady quite fast. The old guidelines may be old and referring to injections every 4 weeks. You do need time for E2 levels to steady as well.

If you are feeling good, there is really no reason to rush things.

I agree about the dose vs body weight. If you add hCG can can increase T somewhat as well.

Dr. Crisler states that it takes 5-6 weeks to get steady levels when dosing once per week. I don’t know if dosing more frequently shortens this time span?

Regardless, I will wait 5 weeks. I am wondering about the trough that I could be getting right before my next injection. I felt blah yesterday (injection day) and now about 33 hours after the injection I am feeling better.

I realize that I will likely need HCG in the future, but DAMN I had a BAD reaction to novarel.

Let’s see where T cyp alone puts my T and E levels.

[quote]chemman wrote:
Dr. Crisler states that it takes 5-6 weeks to get steady levels when dosing once per week. I don’t know if dosing more frequently shortens this time span?

Regardless, I will wait 5 weeks. I am wondering about the trough that I could be getting right before my next injection. I felt blah yesterday (injection day) and now about 33 hours after the injection I am feeling better.

I realize that I will likely need HCG in the future, but DAMN I had a BAD reaction to novarel.

Let’s see where T cyp alone puts my T and E levels. [/quote]

When people start HCG is stimulate your metabolize through increasing thyroid out put. When you took HCG you stimulate the arenals (which were low) and then the thyroid. The excessive metabolism from the testosteorne and thyroid was too much for adrenals to handle which resulted in the anxiety you were feeling which is common with people with hyperthyroidism.

Now does this make sense to why you responded badly to HCG? It over stimulate you metabolism from 2 different pathways that adrenals were unable to support. So may be in your case HCG may not be applied right away until you let the adrenals heal.

There is a lot of information out there about how pregnancy impacts a woman’s thryoid function, and since men on HRT are on HcG (like pregnant women) and may have increased estrogen issues (like pregnant women) there may be some correlation.

“hCG is similar to TSH and mildly stimulates the thyroid to produce more thyroid hormone. Increased estrogen produces higher levels of thyroid-binding globulin, a protein that transports thyroid hormone in the blood. These normal hormonal changes can sometimes make thyroid function tests during pregnancy difficult to interpret.” (this is per www.patient.org.in/hormonal/pregnancy-and-thyroid-disease.htm)

Basically HcG can cause symptoms of hyperthyroidism. I learned this the hard way whn my doctor tried to bump me up to .5iu of HcG E3D when I was already on 120mg Armour daily. Anxiety attacks are not fun.

HCG did not give me much anxiety. Instead it made me extremely depressed to the point that the tears just streamed out of me for hours straight. I could not even move! No joke!

I really do think that HCG stimulates a lot of estradiol production in my testicles.

[quote]PureChance wrote:
There is a lot of information out there about how pregnancy impacts a woman’s thryoid function, and since men on HRT are on HcG (like pregnant women) and may have increased estrogen issues (like pregnant women) there may be some correlation.

“hCG is similar to TSH and mildly stimulates the thyroid to produce more thyroid hormone. Increased estrogen produces higher levels of thyroid-binding globulin, a protein that transports thyroid hormone in the blood. These normal hormonal changes can sometimes make thyroid function tests during pregnancy difficult to interpret.” (this is per www.patient.org.in/hormonal/pregnancy-and-thyroid-disease.htm)

Basically HcG can cause symptoms of hyperthyroidism. I learned this the hard way whn my doctor tried to bump me up to .5iu of HcG E3D when I was already on 120mg Armour daily. Anxiety attacks are not fun.[/quote]

Could this also explain why HcG stimulates fat loss?

It might, but I haven’t done enough digging into the subject yet.

Isn’t it odd that many women have problems with weightloss after having kids. Could HcG have messed up their thyroid functions so that post-pregnancy they now have hypothyroidism along with other imbalances?

I also wonder what the HcG weightloss treatments do to people’s thryoid/hormone functions - desensitizing leydig cells, stressing adrenals, throwing off thyroid functions, etc.

[quote]Substance P wrote:

[quote]PureChance wrote:
There is a lot of information out there about how pregnancy impacts a woman’s thryoid function, and since men on HRT are on HcG (like pregnant women) and may have increased estrogen issues (like pregnant women) there may be some correlation.

“hCG is similar to TSH and mildly stimulates the thyroid to produce more thyroid hormone. Increased estrogen produces higher levels of thyroid-binding globulin, a protein that transports thyroid hormone in the blood. These normal hormonal changes can sometimes make thyroid function tests during pregnancy difficult to interpret.” (this is per www.patient.org.in/hormonal/pregnancy-and-thyroid-disease.htm)

Basically HcG can cause symptoms of hyperthyroidism. I learned this the hard way whn my doctor tried to bump me up to .5iu of HcG E3D when I was already on 120mg Armour daily. Anxiety attacks are not fun.[/quote]

Could this also explain why HcG stimulates fat loss? [/quote]
Stimulates fat loss because most of the people are low on testosterone to begin with.
In women it stimulates progesterone which pretty much every women could use a little more of to help off set the epidemic of estrogen dominance. What stimulate fat loss is more they people are more health aware becaue of when taking hcg they have to actually eat clean and its something they never had an insentive of doing before. They are like If I am using this hcg then I have to follow the program and eat right. Take HCG away they would be more likely to fall off the band wagon so as you can see the hcg has huge placebo effect on modification of lifestyles.