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AAS Used Therapeutically


#1

Therapeutic use of AAS

In general, I think there are two camps of thought with respect to the use of AAS:

  1. Use the most sh*t you can to get as f*cking big as you possibly can

  2. Use moderate dosages and cycle

There should be a third: use of small amounts of AAS for therapeutic reasons.

What?s therapeutic use? My definition can be summarized in the following example scenarios:

  1. A mostly natural athlete suddenly gets the damn flu or a horrendous cold. This effects his eating and training. A good small dose of AAS taken on the sick days and then discontinuing after the episode is over will maintain most of the athlete?s lean mass and counter the lack of calories and meager training stimulus.

  2. A mostly natural athlete has a particularly sh*tty week at work. He has to put in a ton of overtime and there is no convenient time to eat as correctly as he/she should. Training is still maintained throughout the week, but by Friday, holy smokes?the athlete is bushed. A good small dose of AAS taken over the weekend coupled with some good rest and food will recharge this athlete for the next week.

There are many more possible scenarios to illustrate my point, but in general, I believe AAS can and should be used as supplements are used today. A small dose of AAS can be just as effective if not much more so than a higher dosage of supplements which sometimes (well, oftentimes) cost much more than the AAS do.

No one is going to become swole over this protocol, but it WILL make you lifting life easier when faced with high levels of stress.

If the dosages are small enough (everyone is so damn different there really can be no "guidelines". You have to figure things our mostly yourself in my experience), the duration very very short, there will no extremely little to absolutely no side effects.

Why am I writing this? I'm are starting to get pretty sick of some of my gym acquantances who are so hell bent against anything to do with AAS. Just mention "steroid" and they go ape shit. AAS have their place like every other "aid" for whatever ailment exists out there.


#2

I'm curious as to why there weren't any responses to this thread. Is the OP's idea legitimate? In other words, would someone see an appreciable effect in terms of mood/recovery/etc from the ultra-short-term use of AAS?

I fall squarely into "scenario two" outline above-- a natural trainee with a very demanding job that can leave me totally wiped out with my workouts suffering, and those are the times when I want/need good workouts to get my head right.

I've been wondering for some time whether low-dose short-term AAS use on occasion could help me. I have a few questions about the idea the OP puts forth and how it could be implemented safely...

Would methenolone acetate tablets be a suitable choice to achieve the recharge/boost effect the original poster describes? I thought of it because it's non-aromatizing, relatively short-acting, not 17-alkylated and does not have liver toxicity problems. Since the use would be so short-term (a weekend, let's say), the cost issues related to dosage wouldn't be prohibitive.

Or would oxandrolone tablets be a better choice? Bill Roberts seems to think methenolone acetate is a better compound
because of the lower cost and the fact that it's not 17-alkylated. Also, since I'm prone genetically to hair loss I'd like something that's not very androgenic, but I'm wondering whether the idea of this sort of supplementation wouldn't work with the low-androgenic compounds.

If this sort of very short-term use is a good choice (and I'm hoping I get some responses here), would I need to be concerned about side effects and consider having Clomid or something else like it around? The OP suggested that the short duration would make side effects/suppression less of an issue, but I'm still curious what you guys think.

Thanks for any responses-- I'm new to this but have been trying to do my reading, ask informed questions, and approach it all rationally.


#3

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#4

You have a very good argument here Bushy, and I think the "answer" lies in an individual's general disposition. If someone has a gung-ho makeup, they may start off with the therapeutic protocol and then go diving off to higher dosages, etc. Similiar to the individual who begins drinking, but then graduates to cocaine. Not everyone will do this, but some percentage of the population will.

With regards to the gym "buddies": they are good guys, but extremely "religious" when it comes to steroids. I'm trying to understand the deeper psychology of "legal medication is OK to take, but illegal ones like steroids are bad!". I think it could be that some people want others to tell them what is right for them (politicians, doctors, etc). On the other hand, folks like me question the motivations and even general understanding of those who make the policy over us and decide to take things that effect only us into our own hands. As long as I am not hurting another, I say fair game.


#5

SMUT Warrior I'm with you. Started experimenting with Deca recently to help heal a knee injury given that I'm 37 years old. I'm at 100 kilos pretty lean and more interested in health and strength than bulking up.


#6

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#7

I'm mainly doing AAS for therapeutic reasons, which is to rebuild my body after 3 years of weight loss and drug use (speed/crank/meth). I'm literally trying to do a Christian Bale, and aim to go from his size in 'The Machinist' to his size in 'Batman Returns'.

I had trained naturally for a few years, and was in very good shape pretty buff and solid. Then I got major depression, started smoking again and literally wasted away to 58 kg over those years. I did look like Christian Bale in The Machinist at my lowest point.

So I've just been doing low doses of AAS to rebuild and reconstruct my body therapeutically, and regain my self-respect.


#8

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#9

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#10

Well, I wouldn't say I was 'addicted' to rec drugs, as that is just common groupthink and I used that word because it is something everyone can relate to. I'm going to edit out that word because it doesn't suit my own point of view.

I would put it more as that I was using amphetamine as a tool for deep focus and introspection as to why I was depressed. I don't regret it and I certaintly learned a lot from it. But I started to fall into a high intermediate habitual use pattern and I was sick of being skinny & needed to get a life again, so I had to quit.

hGH seems to be exotic, expensive and hard to get for me, but I would certainly consider it if I could get my hands on it. But isn't there a risk of acromegaly (enlarged jaw and forehead) from using hGH? I suppose it's all dependent on dose and other factors, just like anything else.


#11

I've been thinking alot about this general subject too, a more moderate approach. I've been off AAS for just shy of 2 years. Before that I cycled off and on for about 8 years. Towards the end I got really into the hardcore approach, really upping the dosages, and never really coming off.

Finally got off because my wife and I wanted more children and my sperm count was 0 ! It took me just over a year too really get back to normal.

Anyway, I've been thinking alot lately, for people who have their training and nutrition really nailed down, why not try a low dose, short duration course of anabolics for specific situations? For example, I recently started Berardi's Get Shredded Diet.

I've been cruising along at 10-12% for awhile and decided to see if I could still get down to 4-6%, just for the hell of it. So I'm thinking during a bout of super restrictive dieting, maybe a low dose of winstrol or anavar for a 2-3 week time period could be really beneficial. Just to help maintain/preserve LBM while accelerating/aiding in fat loss. Here'ssome of my rationalization:

For someone already in great shape,who has their training and nutrition spot on, who is close to their natural limits in size, strength and bf%, a low dose regimen used more in a therapeutic capacity could have great effects.


#12

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#13

In a medical sense, aas aren't used a heck of a lot. There is increasing evidence in the literature that hormone replacement is a good thing as we age. It keeps muscle mass from declining, preserves strength, bone density, overall well-being. They are sometimes used in diseases that cause wasting...HIV, cancer etc. Not too much. Very few docs would use them for speeding the recovery from injury, but I can see the benefit with some injuries, and would consider using them in certain circumstances.

By and large, the vast majority of aas that I personally write are for hormone replacement. They are used a physiologic doses, and nobody would ever get notably larger at those doses. These are guys with pituitary and/or testicular failure.

Comparing aas to oral contaceptives is like comparing apples and oranges. The physiologic effect is subtle, fooling the body into not ovulating. There are some adverse effects, but there seem to be some benefits....reduction in the rate of some gynecologic cancers etc. It is also socially acceptable, which while it may seem like a lame excuse, it counts for a lot. Aas have a lot of side effects, lots of long-term ill effects. If I were to give you Test, at doses you wanted to use, you may develop a nice pair of bitch tits, and you would likely be able to successfully sue me. A few years later, when you had premature coronary disease and dropped dead in the gym at 45, your family would likely successfully sue me. I don't like that very much.


#14

I respectfully disagree with some of your statements.

I'm 41. I bet I won't drop dead at 45 from complications of steroid use. Your last paragraph is the same old medical community arguments used against the juice. "Lots of side effects...lots of long term ill-effects..."...all old hat thinking.

No one in this thread mentioned the use of "doses you want to use", which I take you are ASSUMMING is supraphysiological ranges. If you made this assumption, I agree that side effects could happen.

The use of therapeutic dosages for short periods of time do indeed have a use in our world today; especially for us weightlifters, bodybuilders, and powerlifters. In my case I have tried it, monitored it, and will continue to use it whenever I'm in particularly abnormal stress situations as I mentioned in the original post.

By the way, I mentioned my experiment and my slight issue with blood lipid values. Blood lipid levels went down to normal basal values if I stayed off of the regimen for at least 2 weeks. As with all of my results, this is how it works for me. Others may experience different results.


#15

im interested in its therapeutic use in joint health recovery e.g cartilage :x


#16

Normally AAS use will cause imunnosupression. I don't know about the low dosages you are talking about here, but I would advice caution and serious research on this topic.

Being stressed out and feeling run down and countering that with AAS may not be a good idea if imunnosupression is added to the stress that caused the run down feeling in the forst place.

Very very interresting topic.
What I see is that the ones that keep their gains and make steady progress are the ones who stick with very low doses more regularly.

Against "conventional practices" they stay on low doses for a long time or use every other week etc..
With great results.


#17

However, in supraphysiologic doses this is true. If you don't want to use doses which are supra-physiologic, you would be happy with androderm, or test enthanate 100mg every 2 weeks.

You could. Here's the problem. Then endocrine system is pretty smart. It shuts down it's own hormone production once it determines there is enough of it in the system. You start taking exogenous test, your endogenous test production goes down...pretty quickly. What's the point, unless you go supraphysiologic...that's where you get the "good" effects.

Yeah, I would expect that. If you are in your 40's and not using AAS in high-dose cycles for months or years, you won't get premature coronary disease. As for you lipids, the effects of elevated lipids are cumulative. Let's say you are on AAS 6 mos of the year with an everage total cholsterol of 300 with bad HDL to LDL ratios. The other 6 mos, you have good cholesterol...say 210 with good ratios. You are still doing damage to your vessels.

The thing that will keep most docs from prescribing AAS is that fact that they are Schedule 2, and there is no indication for muscle building. The legal implications for me are huge. I have $200K in med school debt, and I can't afford to lose my license. The side effects are there, although people who use AAS tend to minimize or rationalize them.
I have some patients on the gear, I monitor their blood, tell them when I think they are using way too much. They rarely listen. I see the guys with the elevated liver functions, explain that this comes from one thing....liver cell damage. I see their blood pressure rise, their cholesterol get horrible. I think you can probably use AAS safely in controlled conditions. Unfortunately, the controlled conditions are often hard to come by, and the people using them are often deaf to advice you give them.


#18

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#19

Here is an article with a bunch of links under it:

http://archsurg.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/131/11/1186


#20

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