A Little Rant About Life

Let’s take another look at this:

Over the years, my experience with friends has been similar to this: I join a new group, everything seems great for a couple of months, then I start to notice most people just plain can’t stand me. The context changes, but it’s always like this.

Up until I was 15 I’d never kissed a girl, but although I’m not particularly good looking, I now don’t have problems with that aspect. I’ve had 6ish girlfriends and have been with about 30 girls over the past 3 years. I’ve currently been with my gf for about 4-5 months.

Around November, I fought with some people belonging to my group and now pretty much all of them hate me. I’m only left with my best girl friend (which also used to be somewhat of a friend with benefits), who is the only person I really trust apart from my mother, and a handful of acquaintances that I go out with.

Consider your attitude in the context of the greater life problem you posted a month ago, where one by one people get to know you and pull away, disgusted. Does it work?

I haven’t seen MGTOW in your posts, I’m probably not reading attentively, but let’s ask this: is it okay for a girl to use a guy who likes her; the beta orbiter? Rides to school, paying for dates, weed if they’re into that - and then she moves on as soon as she gets someone she really likes. Is it okay for her to do the “I’m not ready for sex” thing and still enjoy the rides and dinners and Valentine’s Day candy and etc? Is it okay if she does that but is blowing or having sex with the guys she really likes; the alphas? Or would it be behavior we might all agree is disgusting? Not because a guy paying for a date is gross, but because coldly using him for that is.

So meet your equal-but-opposite: she is the moderately attractive girl (let’s say a 7 on a 1-10 scale) who goes to bars with her girlfriends to score drinks from guys who believe her flirting indicates real interest - they’re thinking they’re probably going to score. But they’re not. Unless she wants to settle down - maybe she’s pregnant now and the baby daddy isn’t interested because he’s also an immature, self-centered prick. So she grabs onto the Nice Guy and keeps him through the hard years of infancy and toddlerhood, then drops him when the kid hits school and she has enough time and freedom to start looking around again for something better. No big deal for her - she’ll keep half his shit regardless, so replacing him with a sexier model costs nothing. She can always settle down with another sucker later!

That’s what I see in your posts. If you were an 18-year-old girl complaining about not having friends because she can only get along with the guys hoping to score with her, whom she uses freely as long as they’ll tolerate it, I would say she should rethink her motives and actions. Sure, the guys orbiting her have free will. They don’t have to keep trying to buy her affection. But that doesn’t change that she’s not nice and that’s why no one likes her.

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Of course not, but here’s my take on it:

(Disclaimer! I’m answering your example and, although I know you asked me about this to make your point, my answer is strictly to your question and is not to be mirrored and used as the answer to the question if my behavior is okay. I’ll get to just later.)

Most girl (AWALT?) tend to act the way you described. If you are by any means familiar with trp’s philosophy, which you sound like you might be, you know it’s often said that acting like this is in their nature (please, females that are reading this, don’t hate on me lol, I’m just describing what they say over there), so since this is factual, if a guy fails to acknowledge this and lets her use him, isn’t the blame to be put on him ultimately? He’s the one being fooled, so that’s on him. The girl’s behavior is still sad, but since we can’t control what’s external to us, it’s our fault if we let it take us over.

That’s why I now make a point to avoid giving more than I’m given. This might be the single best teaching from reading trp—there’s some bullshit over there IMO, but really this is golden. If I happen to see a girl is starting with this bullshit, I usually quickly next her.

I know this is kinda off topic, but paying for a date because you hope the girl will sleep with you is gross.

I’m really not trying to criticize or anything, but I don’t feel this is an accurate representation of what my behavior is like (even accounting for the “opposite” thing).

I don’t have girls all over me, and although we ended up discussing the way I act with girls, my initial concern has more to do with people in general.

I’m not denying there is something really wrong with my behavior—it doesn’t take a genius to realize this, I just need to look at the results.

Currently I’m gong with another group with people I’m finding myself very well with and are making me enjoy myself. I’m mainly responsible for putting together these people, so there’s that.

I’m trying to be as friendly as possible with them, I’m having a great time and I don’t want to screw up this time. They are aware of my past quarrels with people and they know those people as well—I’m getting LOTS of support from them, who mainly disregarded those people as idiots and are making me feel much better.

When I’m with them, I feel less like I’m the problem and more like it’s all complex and everybody has varying degrees of fault but like it’s not that big of a deal.

Then there are times I feel empty and like shit. I know I said “everybody ends up hating me,” but maybe it’s not literally so. There are behaviors I put into action that makes most people feel bad about me as I’ve seen, but figuring them out isn’t as easy as it looks.

I know I sound like I’m defending myself but really what you said is correct, it’s my fault, but I have like an emotional storm inside and everything feels like it’s put under a magnifying glass, so everything hurts worse, and everything seems like bigger a deal.

This was kind of a confused post and I probably missed the point big time, but I did my best to respond to your points with my thoughts. Let me know

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Actually it was an honest post! Thanks for letting us in. I went through life with an emptiness and finally have found a purpose in life

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It’s sociopathic from either direction. Not all women are like that, as not all men are without moral responsibility or social conscience. It isn’t that it’s “in their nature” for them to act this way, it’s that these men and women are natural matches for one another and so continually reinforce each other’s distorted thinking about the other side’s moral poverty. And then, it seems, go online and talk about it.

Nice people prioritize doing the right thing and avoid needlessly hurting people. They don’t justify poor behavior through a sense of entitlement derived from the notion that the other side is worse, so deserve what they get.

What makes for a nice life or a nice early romance or whatever is when both people give freely in the context of a reciprocal relationship, even if it’s not going to be a forever thing or isn’t particularly serious.

I would say the same of friendships. Users aren’t good friends. If you’re going to keep your new friend group some thought about what is good for them and what you can do to make their lives happier or better might be in order. Some focus on others might also help to fill the emptiness. Francis Bacon said “Divide with reason between self-love and society; and be so true to thyself, as thou be not false to others; specially to thy king and country. It is a poor centre of a man’s actions, himself.” (Emphasis his.) He allows for being true to yourself (don’t be a sucker), but suggests that pure self-interest is not conducive to a life well lived.

I love this so much.

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Yeah, perhaps @SkyzykS was just making light of it a bit. I don’t think he’d be “scarred” by your description.

I was joking comparing him to someone who’s manipulating young girls they aren’t even attracted to into giving head.

Obviously oral is a bit gross, weird and taboo. That’s what makes it fun. In a normal healthy relationship, it’s a non issue.

Let’s stop it already, shall we? How does getting head from a girl, that apparently wants to do it if she’s doing it without constriction, even remotely compare to “manipulating” her into doing it?

Is the pretty girl’s acceptance of favors from insecure/weak guys she knows are doing it to win her favor, which they’re not going to win because she’s sort of grossed out that they’re so easy to game, manipulation? You know it is. Same thing.

I feel confident that even if he is scarred by it, he’ll recover quickly!

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So if I like a girl and I want to have sex with her, and she wants it too, I shouldn’t?

I get what you’re saying if I “take advantage” of a girl that likes me and would like to be my girlfriend and I only let her suck my dick but really, if she only wants fun, where’s the manipulation?

So, scrolled through this pretty fast, but there is a ton of good shit in here and I wanted to add my .02.

First, I prefer to see female therapists, it’s all I have ever seen. I currently have two. I prefer them because a lot of my issues have to do with my childhood and they tend to be more nurturing. They’re therapists, they’ve heard everything and won’t judge you.

Second, the bottom line is that you aren’t clear about who you are, which is understandable given your age. You should continue thinking about who you are and who you want to be. When you love yourself you won’t need casual sex for comfort.

You don’t currently love yourself because you don’t know who you are. So you do shit that you know you shouldn’t do, and that creates low self esteem that you try to mitigate by seeking approval from others in the form of casual sex.

You are very reflective, and obviously intelligent. That intelligence causes you problems because you don’t have the moral discipline yet to do the right thing. If you start doing the right things by exercising moral discipline and mindfulness, you will begin to like yourself and stop looking to others for approval. I suspect your therapist will help you tremendously in this aspect.

You have a phenomenal opportunity to become great. Make the choices that will take you to where you want to be. Exercise the moral discipline to make the right choices so that you will like who you are. Then you can run your life from a position of strength rather than from needing the approval of others.

Move a muscle, change a thought.

You got this bro.

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You seem to start each response to me with a challenge (“and she wants it too, I shouldn’t?”) and then close your response with an acknowledgement that you understand what I’m saying. I can tell you DO understand my point and so I have to assume you’re looking for a loophole. So in a general sense I would say to you what I used to say to people years ago when I worked at a weight loss center, which was that of course you can do what you want to do, but if what you want to do is lose weight, then what you need to do is follow the program.

So Samul, of course you can do what you want to do, but if what you want to do is feel good about yourself, then what you need to do is to behave in ways that earn your own good judgment. If you and a nice girl have a free and happy, clean and wholesome relationship - she is confident in herself and trusts you, but has plans for the future that don’t allow for a relationship with you or anyone, but she believes that sex is a natural and healthy way to spend an hour or two - then yes, go ahead and enjoy. No one is hurt, no one feels badly about themselves when they’re lying alone in the dark, thinking about what they did.

I’m going to trust you to figure out the difference between a clean, wholesome relationship based on friendship and sex, and one that serves your self-interest but not hers.

Again I point out that letting someone “suck you off” because it feels good to you and they’re willing is not different than me accepting drinks from someone all night because they’re expensive and the guy wants to do it obviously, so…?

So much good advice in here.

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Amen to all of that. You’re right and I really don’t have anything to add.

Now, onto the root of all of this: we obviously discussed the topic of “self-judgment” and how I should act in order to be okay with myself and my behavior.

However, I believe that me not “loving” myself because of my behavior is only part of the problem.

So since my new therapist suggested I write down every time I start having bad feelings out of the blue so we can discuss them tomorrow, I’ll post here an example.

This morning I woke up in a bad(ish) mood, thinking about my ex gf. Ever since we broke up, I had mostly “ups” and was happy with my new group of friends. Starting from a couple of days ago, I started having more “downs,” moments in which I’d sit down and start thinking about what there was between me and her.

I’d keep having flashback about particularly meaningful moments with her. This morning I was trying to study until something reminded me of a thing about her. Then it all snowballed. I started thinking back about me and her, about some of the best memories, and while I was initially able to hold tears back, eventually I gave in and cried.

I was both sad and angry at myself for not being totally over this yet. Then I started thinking rationally about how it wasn’t all smiles and happiness. I tired to remember all the stuff that I didn’t like about her–and there were a lot.

How come is that I only remember the good and get nostalgic about something that in reality it was only half as good as I remember it?

I have worries, for example, not that I necessarily won’t find another girl (I used to get worried about silly shit like this as well, in the past), but that I’m nowhere near finding another one with whom I could have a “stable” relationship like with this one. I believe that, even though this girl had lots of things I didn’t like and eventually it probably wouldn’t have worked out anyway, if I hadn’t screwed up this bad, there were solid basis for a long relationship. I’d never gone 5 months with a girl this smoothly. She was probably decent “LTR material,” unlike most girls I met so far.

Then I get the “highs”—my best friend, another girl friend of mine, and that girl I mentioned that sucked me off a couple of weeks ago (the one that’d liked me for 5 months and hoped I’d eventually become her bf all along) are currently going through a drama war: the blowjob girl, that from now on I’ll simply call K, is accusing my best friend, A, and the other girl, G, of being “double faced” because of lots of events I won’t get into.

K’s doing this by posting Instagram stories with her friends basically insulting A and G but without directly mentioning her. You know, stupid drama shit.

A and G responded as well with other stories, and to them K answered with another story, in which one of the sentences was, addressing my two girl friends, “let’s see how long this friendship lasts. They’re all friends until they want the same dick… Might as well end up doing a threesome, why not?”

Why am I saying all of this? Of course the dick she mentioned was mine (even though I never did anything with G like I did with A, I still made out with her a couple of times), and all of this gave me some good feelings.

I’m speculating that all of this was making me feel like a “prize,” like I am important. Or maybe it just takes my focus away from my sadness for my ex, as it gives me a reality check—if I care this much about other girls, it can only mean that I don’t (didn’t maybe?) care this much about her.

It’s like telling myself, “what the hell are you stressing over? She’s no one to you anymore, and look, you aren’t just pretending, it’s actually so, look, there are other girls in your thoughts. How could you be so tied to her?”

So there’s this. I’m getting downs in which I have regrets and am scared for the future, and ups in which I realize thee ARE people caring for me, I’m not alone, and there’s much I can do in life. But ultimately, I’m on an emotional roller coaster and I don’t know if it only has to do with my actions and the subsequent self judgment or if there’s more to that.

I left my first husband but let him come home because I started missing those “little” things and couldn’t feel comfortable with anyone intimately because I still had feelings for him. He looked like Kurt Warner (sorry nfl reference), but he showed up crying to get me back. We lasted 3 months before the “real” him resurfaced and the memories of harm he’d done came back. Please focus on yourself and healing or you could be oh so so regretful. It’s good you are seeing a therapist. Seriously, I’d take some time for self-reflection with your therapist and work through how to process and cope. Don’t be a dumbass and let toxicity return to your world…I know marriage is more extreme but the feelings you feel, lots of people. Feel. Luckily you are working on them with a professional. Just learn about yourself and develop self-respect and inner strength. I personally am working on getting a “thicker” skin and trusting people and evaluating if they are good for me or not. Everything has a lesson in life. My hubby is teaching me that, now. I’m so lucky to have him. What lessons about yourself are you learning, think about it. What do you want today?

Even though I feel empty and I only sometimes find fulfillment in the things I do, I think that what I would want is not a change in what my life looks like, as much as a change in how I feel about my life.

After all, I believe I have a normal teenage life, nothing too different from that of my peers. So I don’t hope for a change in my life—I’m trying to elicit a change in myself, so I react differently to what happens outside.

That’s what I think I should pursue.

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I’m working on the same thing. I’m a recovering anorexic and wanted to “fit” in throwing away so much in my life and then finally having a wake up call. You, are realizing and seeking help and accepting you need to change. So do you have a list on what you want to work on today? Just take one day at a time. I didn’t gain over 40 lbs in one day. It took time, patience, dedication and listening to my body, heart,and mind. I had actually taught myself mentally to never “feel” hunger. That’s how powerful your mind can be. So you’ve accepted you need to change some things. So, start fresh today and do what’s best for you today. Set daily goals, and if fail, get back on the horse the next day. Life is about acceptance and moving on or holding close to your heart. I hope this helps some.

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Sorry forgot “hug”:hugs:. It’ll be ok. I think it’s funny nobody has asked me what the hug thing is about. I grew up with the shittiest of parents. Have bad ptsd and my husband (married to now) brought me a dozen roses and a bear. I laughed at him. I said roses die and stuffed animals don’t hug back…I hope you kept your receipt. I learned to Be a bit of a bitch early on. So, now I’m trying to give people that which wasn’t given to me In my life and to try to compensate from my :carrot: up the ass uptightness. :rofl:

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I’m so not a feminist but we were friends first so he knew better. I’d seen his game before. I was hoping for something that meant something not just his typical “routine”. I hate bs, being misled or an emotional punching bag. Anyways, on our second date he gave me a set of keys to his apt. He said “is this from the heart”. Gotta love the guy!

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I have but I always procrastinated away at the idea of starting to actually read something about it. I’ll now take a look at the links you posted, so thank you.

I do agree with this and this is probably part of the reason I’ve been suffering. I’m subconsciously trying to delude me into thinking there is something left (I keep rehearsing memories and I can do little to help it) whereas consciously I know and completely acknowledge that once a book is closed, it’s closed.

So I see reality for what it is, I’m not deluding myself, but still suffer about what it is.

Sometimes your heart takes more time to process what your mind already has accepted. That’s why I say relax. You’ve got time

lol - you really should stop procrastinating. You’re Italian, right? Read Marcus Aurelius, Meditations - it’s a short read but should take you a good while to read it. He was the last of the 5 great Roman emperors and a practicing Stoic. Meditations was his diary/private thoughts. It was him practicing stoicism. Very great book. Great insights from the one of the ancient Roman world’s most powerful men. Plus, he’s your kin - what more do you want?

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