531 & Conditioning

Hi ladies & gents

Looking at adding some barbell complexes, WODs etc into my planning for conditioning,

I have books such as Forever 531, Beyond, TB2, Dan Johns Easy Strength which has a wide variety of plans available so I’m after a little guidance to what works, what should be avoided on particular days etc:

I have read loads of stuff written from mythical strength which he included WODs and complexes but 1) he’s far superior in terms of fitness and strength than I certainly am 2) he clearly stated that even though he had 4-5 hard conditioning workouts whilst running something like Beefcake he also had a lot of easy/endurance based work to compensate and for his running:

Anyway, my conditioning is purely work capacity related no such conditioning targets other than improving recovery between sets and to add a little something: ideally these sessions will be directly after my main lifts and supplement work as 4 days is my maximum training frequency for anything, potentially 3 as I posted recently regarding

TB2: gives out black and green planning after base building which gives info on E, HIC for GC or PD

My schedule I was planning on trying was something like

Strength: Squat 531 BBB
Conditioning: 20-30 min row

Strength: Bench 531 BBB
Conditioning: Grace Wod or Sledge Drills from TB2

Strength: Deadlifts 531 BBB
Conditioning: Slurpees or Humane Burpees from Dan John/Fran to add pull up volume or Burpees 3-2-1 from TB2

Strength: Press 531 BBB
Conditioning: Weighted Vest Walk

I hope all this makes sense and sorry to have opened a new topic, I know it’s said that conditioning should be made simple and not over thought which I probably have done

Thank you for any input

As someone that includes conditioning like that found in TB2 and plenty of WODs from Crossfit, I wouldn’t be overly prescriptive about the hard conditioning. Get variety in this aspect of your training.

Also, it seems like you are proposing to do BBB workouts and a WOD on the same day. Many would find this to be too much, and you’ll end up either cheating yourself on your strength work or not going hard enough on your WOD. This type of training approach I s covered in TB workouts. For most, the following would work better:

  1. Do your hard conditioning on separate days from your strength training.
  2. Use a minimal strength template (not BBB) if done on the same days as a CrossFit-style WOD. This would be something like 5x5 or 531 for only one or at most two lifts. And choose carefully. I’d save my squats and deads for days where I don’t have a WOD planned. Check out some of Tanner Shuck’s stuff, as he incorporates crossfit-style training within a strength workout.

The main thing is to be honest with yourself. You’ll see better results if you get in two really hard WODs/HIC workouts in a week compared to doing four that end up being slogs.

Thank you for that advice

The 531 and BBB is something I 100% want to continue has it’s something I’ve totally got into, obviously will try other templates along the way but conditioning isn’t my thing and it more along the lines of work capacity and training 6 days a week certainly isn’t something I’m interesting in or can commit to, so I may leave the WODs and TB stuff totally out or just do minimal hard efforts on the mini deload week when it’s at 50% TM and look at just basic 20 min easy rowing one day and 30 min weighted walk on another and leave it as that then for now

Although will certainly look up the recommendations thank you

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tagging in @T3hPwnisher just because you mentioned his blog.

I agree with @antiquity in that I wouldn’t usually run hard conditioning on the same day as my strength work. But saying that, doing something hard and horrible for 5 mins at the end of workout isn’t going to kill all your gainz. I do my conditioning work on my non gym days but none of it is planned. I just pick something based on time and how I feel on the day. The goal is always to just get the heart rate high and to hate myself for doing it.

You may want to look at something by Brian Alsruhe (formerly Alpha on here). He has some programs that include conditioning as part of the strength work.

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Hey @Ironrhino10!

FWIW, I’ve run Forever BBB and BBB Beefcake while keeping two days of JW’s hard conditioning in the mix—I pushed the sled for something like 500 yards, sometimes in a weighted vest, on press and bench days—and while running several WOD-style workouts, often stolen from @T3hPwnisher’s Little Book of Bad Ideas, as well.

Is that smart?

I don’t know.

But I survived it, my work capacity was probably as high as it’s ever been, and it drove my appetite through the roof, which is exactly what I wanted in those gaining phases.

I’m currently running a mashed up version of the 5/3/1 & Bodybuilding template where I’ve replaced the daily easy conditioning (a weighted vest walk of 30-45 minutes) from the actual 5/3/1 & Bodybuilding template with 500 daily KB swings and a 10-minute WOD-style workout on lifting days.

Smart?

I don’t know.

But I’m feeling pretty good and, once again, my appetite is where I want it to be for a gaining phase.

Anyway, I just wanted to offer a different perspective.

Regardless, @simo74 hit the nail on the head:

If you do that—and do it consistently—you’ll get results.

Sons interesting comments there, you finished your bench and pressing days with prowler so that’s combining upper and lower so your hitting them both fresh

I was tempted to use a rower in hard intervals as one hard Conditioning to keep away from any pounding from tarmac when running as an example, I’ve never used a prowler and have zero access to one so I was looking at something like the basic version of Indoor Power Intervals from TB2: 5 x 60/90/120 seconds maximal effort depending upon fitness keeping a really light active recovery in between sets to replicate the “sprint” or can just be 20-30 minutes easy pace

The weighted vest I do directly after my press anyway non optional, daughter has youth club so I make that my press day (least amount of equipment and weight required day) and do it at a local park, pack up the car and finish off with a 30 minute weighted vest walk, hoping to get further each time

With 2 already being cardio based conditoning I was looking at a WOD style to work into a day, maybe it’s not the best idea:
Been tempted to remove the BBB deadlifts and use a WOD of something like deadlifts, pull ups, dips EMOM style esc

I have a goal Spartan race in July which I’ll need Conditioning for but it’s far from my target currently so steady small progress in Conditioning is perfectly fine for now, and 12-16 weeks out I’ll change templates more suitable for that.