does’nt Ronnie do heavey benches, squats and DL’s? He is a bodybuilder right?
[quote]lewhitehurst wrote:
dratner wrote:
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You spend more time asking questions about what to do, rather than getting your ass out there and doing it.
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You spend more time reading and arguing with people on forums, rather than reading articles or books from some of the best coaches and authors in the business.
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You can’t describe the training style of Arnold versus Dorian, Ronnie versus Mentzer, or Nimrod King versus Branch Warren.
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You substitute pull downs for pull ups, leg extensions for squats, machine presses for heavy ass benching.
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You still think red meat and egg yolks are bad for you. HA!
For those who have a physique worthy of noting, please add…
Scratching my head at #3. I can’t tell you the differences between their training style, nor do I care that I can’t.
As far as #4 goes, once your strength gets to a certain level, you HAVE to use machines for safety reasons and to protect your body. I DO know Dorian said that. 
I applaud the sentiment, but you sound like you got angry at someone at the gym and came on here to vent.
[/quote]
The OP has been served. OP you might want to think about focusing on your own progress and goals rather than that of others. It has been said many times, but actions speak louder than words, both written and spoken.
- You’re smaller than a 16 year old.
Holy shit. This may be the most retarded thread to be spawned in at least the last two days.
And that’s saying a lot.
[quote]LarryDavid wrote:
obsoletestate wrote:
LarryDavid wrote:
obsoletestate wrote:
The other Rob wrote:
Some good points, but you aren’t exactly huuuuuuuge yourself mate. Maybe this sort of rant should wait a couple of years?
apparently it’s cool for everyone on the internet to hate something or someone. also it seems using the term “no homo” is a pretty big hit also.
Fuck you (no homo).
Get it? I hated on someone, and I said no homo.
haha. yea, not this board so much but bb.com. where the person will make a comment like nice ass bra, no homo.
LOL I see. This is the only bbing board I go on. [/quote]
I frequent BB.com more than here (starting to change) and hate when people say (no homo) after everything. i made a thread about it and everything, its just saying your insecure with your sexuality/such a pussy you care what random people you’ll never meet think about you/actually so stupid as to care about reps.
edit:
found the thread, what i said was:
(No Homo)
is such a stupid thing to post/say. Really.
All your saying is “I’m so insecure with my sexuality that I’m not sure if im gay or not. OR your saying " I dont have confidence in other people that they will know that im not gay, so i have to tell them” OR “I’m a lil b*tch that cares so much what random people on the frickin internet think I have to tread carefully, or else I may be called a homo(oh noes, my worst nightmare!)”
buck up people.
/rant
I WISH I had a smith or hammer strength machine to work with. It could help me push closer to my limits. Don’t get me wrong, I love the bench but it does get limiting when you have to lift conservatively so as not to get pinned to the bench if I can’t muster enough power to lift it.
[quote]dratner wrote:
5. You still think red meat and egg yolks are bad for you. HA![/quote]
I’d agree w/this 1 because I’ve argued with some assholes (yes; fatter, weaker and less healthy assholes) about it, but the Dorian vs Arnold point seems to confuse me.
I’m going to disagree with the statement regarding bodybuilders switching to machines for safety reasons which implies bodybuilders don’t do the big three.
Now I do agree that every pro bodybuilder uses machines but I’ve seen many of the “greats” training videos and all the guys like Flex, Ronnie, Levrone, Ray, Priest, Cutler, Jackson, Warren etc do heavy ass benches, most do squats and free weights are the staples in each of there routines.
Many would do 500 benches and 405 inclines for reps right before a contest (Levrone in Maryland Muscle Machine M3). Chris Corimier comes to mind with some strong ass lifts in the big 3. I can keep going on and on but I figure that’d be enough for now.
Edit: I’m bringing this up as well because you said they “HAVE” to switch to machines which seems to be not the case at all for most.
[quote]austin_bicep wrote:
I’m going to disagree with the statement regarding bodybuilders switching to machines for safety reasons which implies bodybuilders don’t do the big three.
Now I do agree that every pro bodybuilder uses machines but I’ve seen many of the “greats” training videos and all the guys like Flex, Ronnie, Levrone, Ray, Priest, Cutler, Jackson, Warren etc do heavy ass benches, most do squats and free weights are the staples in each of there routines.
Many would do 500 benches and 405 inclines for reps right before a contest (Levrone in Maryland Muscle Machine M3). Chris Corimier comes to mind with some strong ass lifts in the big 3. I can keep going on and on but I figure that’d be enough for now.
Edit: I’m bringing this up as well because you said they “HAVE” to switch to machines which seems to be not the case at all for most. [/quote]
Most of the top guys do use more machines than free weights depending on the body part discussed. Ronnie is a very rare example and even Johnnie Jackson states on his training video that he uses more machines when getting ready for a contest to avoid risking injury and also because there is less lubricant (fat) around his joints as compared to the off season.
Further, Lewhitehurst has the size and development to stand as an example of what does work to get big. Whether the exact same stance will work for you has yet to be seen.
[quote]austin_bicep wrote:
I’m going to disagree with the statement regarding bodybuilders switching to machines for safety reasons which implies bodybuilders don’t do the big three.
Now I do agree that every pro bodybuilder uses machines but I’ve seen many of the “greats” training videos and all the guys like Flex, Ronnie, Levrone, Ray, Priest, Cutler, Jackson, Warren etc do heavy ass benches, most do squats and free weights are the staples in each of there routines.
Many would do 500 benches and 405 inclines for reps right before a contest (Levrone in Maryland Muscle Machine M3). Chris Corimier comes to mind with some strong ass lifts in the big 3. I can keep going on and on but I figure that’d be enough for now.
Edit: I’m bringing this up as well because you said they “HAVE” to switch to machines which seems to be not the case at all for most. [/quote]
You totally misunderstood the statement. Noone said to stop doing free weights and squats. I have actually had the opportunity to watch Kevin workout in person so I know exactly what he was doing and capable of.
I hate to bust your bubble, a 500 pound bench and 405 pound inclines aren’t shit compared to what these guys are capable of and can do when they are pushing it. They aren’t even shit compared to what I do and I am not at any of those guys’ levels.
When you are doing 500+ inclines and you don’t trust anybody around you to spot you or you want to save your joints you DO use machines when you can.
But I can only speak about what I do and what I have seen other strong guys do. If your strength and/or development is at that level and you have other guys at that level who know how to spot you and know your body that well, and you stay away from machines, fine.
If you aren’t at that level please don’t post opinions and suppositions when you don’t have the experience to. Based upon your avatar and the pics I have seen, you don’t even look like you’re at my level, much less theirs.
If I am wrong, and you yourself are at that level I will gladly change my views.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
austin_bicep wrote:
I’m going to disagree with the statement regarding bodybuilders switching to machines for safety reasons which implies bodybuilders don’t do the big three.
Now I do agree that every pro bodybuilder uses machines but I’ve seen many of the “greats” training videos and all the guys like Flex, Ronnie, Levrone, Ray, Priest, Cutler, Jackson, Warren etc do heavy ass benches, most do squats and free weights are the staples in each of there routines.
Many would do 500 benches and 405 inclines for reps right before a contest (Levrone in Maryland Muscle Machine M3). Chris Corimier comes to mind with some strong ass lifts in the big 3. I can keep going on and on but I figure that’d be enough for now.
Edit: I’m bringing this up as well because you said they “HAVE” to switch to machines which seems to be not the case at all for most.
Most of the top guys do use more machines than free weights depending on the body part discussed. Ronnie is a very rare example and even Johnnie Jackson states on his training video that he uses more machines when getting ready for a contest to avoid risking injury and also because there is less lubricant (fat) around his joints as compared to the off season.
Further, Lewhitehurst has the size and development to stand as an example of what does work to get big. Whether the exact same stance will work for you has yet to be seen.[/quote]
I’m talking training year round here, not just getting contest ready. Lime I said as well, Levrone was doing 405 inclines and 500 benches as well as 100 pound DB curls and some other 2 weeks before the Olympia.
Yes he used many machines but he did not HAVE to switch to machines because he was worried he’d be injured benching…I’ll add to, I’ve been getting pretty big lately, almost at a 405 bench and the guns are close to 19s. I’ll be adding some pics too, almost 2 inches of arm growth in 1.5 years and I got a 50 inch chest as well 28 inch quads at there biggest point and I won’t mention the claves. Haha.
[quote]austin_bicep wrote:
Professor X wrote:
austin_bicep wrote:
I’m going to disagree with the statement regarding bodybuilders switching to machines for safety reasons which implies bodybuilders don’t do the big three.
Now I do agree that every pro bodybuilder uses machines but I’ve seen many of the “greats” training videos and all the guys like Flex, Ronnie, Levrone, Ray, Priest, Cutler, Jackson, Warren etc do heavy ass benches, most do squats and free weights are the staples in each of there routines.
Many would do 500 benches and 405 inclines for reps right before a contest (Levrone in Maryland Muscle Machine M3). Chris Corimier comes to mind with some strong ass lifts in the big 3. I can keep going on and on but I figure that’d be enough for now.
Edit: I’m bringing this up as well because you said they “HAVE” to switch to machines which seems to be not the case at all for most.
Most of the top guys do use more machines than free weights depending on the body part discussed. Ronnie is a very rare example and even Johnnie Jackson states on his training video that he uses more machines when getting ready for a contest to avoid risking injury and also because there is less lubricant (fat) around his joints as compared to the off season.
Further, Lewhitehurst has the size and development to stand as an example of what does work to get big. Whether the exact same stance will work for you has yet to be seen.
I’m talking training year round here, not just getting contest ready. Lime I said as well, Levrone was doing 405 inclines and 500 benches as well as 100 pound DB curls and some other 2 weeks before the Olympia.
Yes he used many machines but he did not HAVE to switch to machines because he was worried he’d be injured benching…I’ll add to, I’ve been getting pretty big lately, almost at a 405 bench and the guns are close to 19s. I’ll be adding some pics too, almost 2 inches of arm growth in 1.5 years and I got a 50 inch chest as well 28 inch quads at there biggest point and I won’t mention the claves. Haha. [/quote]
When training in a gym, there is no way in hell I am going to go all out on a free weight bench press unless I am confident in the person spotting me. If you think these guys who are even stronger don’t think the same way, you are deluding yourself.
One muscle tear can ruin their entire career yet you think they take this lightly?
No one wrote that the big lifts are simply completely avoided for no reason and no one wrote that they avoid squats for no reason. You don’t seem to be grasping what is written.
Sorry bud I just turned 19 and I have my opinions because I read and watch many proffesional training vids and I’m sure others at “your” level would agree with me. I don’t have the amount of training years under my belt as you do so to fault me for that would be ridiculous.
Watch any branch Warren training video and he uses hella heavy free weight exercises for everything.
Let’s look at a non bodybuilder but individual built like a bodybuilder, well let’s make that two individuals Konstantine Konstantinovs and Ryan Kennelley. Both easily could win bodybuilding competetion if they chose to get into contest condition, although Konstantinoves stays ultra lean all the time and both squat, bench and dead lift extremely heavy weights.
No doubt machines have there purpose and I’m not here to argue but I completely disagree that bodybuilders HAVE to switch to machines.
I’ll agree if you train heavy and nobody around is strong enough to spot you than sure go ahead and use the machine that’s the logicicalthing to do, but the majority of proffesionals either lift in a hardcore environment or have a partner/trainer to help spot them and whatever else if need be.
Edit: this was not directed at you X but, the other jacked dude, I can’t remember your user name. No need for a bickering match but I still stand by my opinions.
[quote]austin_bicep wrote:
Professor X wrote:
austin_bicep wrote:
I’m going to disagree with the statement regarding bodybuilders switching to machines for safety reasons which implies bodybuilders don’t do the big three.
Now I do agree that every pro bodybuilder uses machines but I’ve seen many of the “greats” training videos and all the guys like Flex, Ronnie, Levrone, Ray, Priest, Cutler, Jackson, Warren etc do heavy ass benches, most do squats and free weights are the staples in each of there routines.
Many would do 500 benches and 405 inclines for reps right before a contest (Levrone in Maryland Muscle Machine M3). Chris Corimier comes to mind with some strong ass lifts in the big 3. I can keep going on and on but I figure that’d be enough for now.
Edit: I’m bringing this up as well because you said they “HAVE” to switch to machines which seems to be not the case at all for most.
Most of the top guys do use more machines than free weights depending on the body part discussed. Ronnie is a very rare example and even Johnnie Jackson states on his training video that he uses more machines when getting ready for a contest to avoid risking injury and also because there is less lubricant (fat) around his joints as compared to the off season.
Further, Lewhitehurst has the size and development to stand as an example of what does work to get big. Whether the exact same stance will work for you has yet to be seen.
I’m talking training year round here, not just getting contest ready. Lime I said as well, Levrone was doing 405 inclines and 500 benches as well as 100 pound DB curls and some other 2 weeks before the Olympia.
Yes he used many machines but he did not HAVE to switch to machines because he was worried he’d be injured benching…I’ll add to, I’ve been getting pretty big lately, almost at a 405 bench and the guns are close to 19s. I’ll be adding some pics too, almost 2 inches of arm growth in 1.5 years and I got a 50 inch chest as well 28 inch quads at there biggest point and I won’t mention the claves. Haha. [/quote]
Ok. I hate to do this shit, buit I am gonna bust your bubble.
243 lbs
19.5 inch arms
29 inch thighs and I haven’t squatted heavy in a year
50 inch chest
495 lbs incline for reps on free weights, 590 for reps on my Powertec
Do we WANT to turn this into a biggest dick contest? I am telling you, you’re about 6 inches short.
Edit: I just saw you’re 19. I’m done. You’ll realize you don’t know everything in about 15 years.
Read my above post dude your comparing yourself to a fucking teenager. Have fun bro. Seriously.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
No one wrote that the big lifts are simply completely avoided for no reason and no one wrote that they avoid squats for no reason. You don’t seem to be grasping what is written.[/quote]
but no one’s saying they HAVE to switch man.
[quote]austin_bicep wrote:
Read my above post dude your comparing yourself to a fucking teenager. Have fun bro. Seriously. [/quote]
But, you are a teenager who claims you know better than one guy who actually trained with Levrone and is significantly more developed than you and another guy who is also more developed than you and has trained with enough really big competitors to know what he is talking about.
If you play with the big boys, don’t turn around and cry about how young you are later.
Really big lifters don’t seem to share this same superstitious belief about free weights as if machines should all be avoided. The people making the most progress utilize all tools.
[quote]austin_bicep wrote:
Read my above post dude your comparing yourself to a fucking teenager. Have fun bro. Seriously. [/quote]
You’re the one who started quoting stats. Funny how when my stats are better than yours you fall back on your age. But like I said, I am done.
I completely agree with the sentiment expressed of Lewhite and Prof X for adjusting how you lift for safety reasons as you get stronger and go heavier. As long as you’re lifting HEAVY relative to the muscle you want to grow, who gives a shit how you do it. As long as you grow, and don’t hurt yourself so you can keep growing long-term, who cares.
Smith press, H/S machines, it doesn’t matter.
No-one can prove to me these ‘machines’ are either bad for growth, or more causative for injury.
IME I have seen more injuries from the all touted incline DB or bar bench (mainly DB) with guys going over 40/45kg DB’s than any other movement in the upper body…doesn’t make it a bad movement, but definitely comes back to the issue of safety with certain exercise when getting stronger and going heavier.
And yes, even the mother of all lifts, the squat, has made me more business over the years from injuries caused than the dreaded, evil, leg extension!!!
[quote]lewhitehurst wrote:
495 lbs incline for reps on free weights, 590 for reps on my Powertec[/quote]
hey lewhite, off topic, but have you considered powerlifting during your lifting career?