T Nation

5 Days After Second Injection, Feeling Horrible. Normal "Valley"?


Thank you. But, shouldn’t I feel better after I inject? At least for a week?

The first time I injected, I felt great all week, and almost up to the second shot. Then when I took my second shot like 4/5 days ago, I feel like crap today.

Why doesn’t it work as long or as well as the first time I shot?


Your natural production is falling off. Your shot isn’t going as far, this can be affected by several things, but mostly by your individual metabolism of testosterone.


Thank you for your response.

So, how would I know what I should bump the shots up to? How do I determine whether it’s:

  1. not enough T,
  2. Injections too far spread from each other, or
  3. whether I need to pair T up with any other injectables (hcg, ai, etc.)

Thanks in advance.


For certain the shots are too far apart, so first step is to move to 100 mg once a week and see how that goes, or 50 mg twice a week would probably work better in your case. Give that like 6 weeks and check your T, free T and E2. If you still don’t feel “right”, the numbers will give you an idea of how much to go up.


Thanks. Very much appreciate your responses.

If I ask my doctor for more T (going from 200mg every 2 weeks, to 200mg every week) will they get suspicious? I don’t want to get into the area where they think this is more so for drug use vs medical use (like with opiates, etc.).


Maybe. It’s better to just ask him to split the existing dose into weekly, and mention the half-life. They will be open to change it from there, and 200 mg a week is likely too much anyway.


You can ask for 100mg weekly and inject 50mg twice weekly and see how you feel. You will have to buy insulin syringes online if you plan on taking control of your protocol, which in this case you should do anyways because your doctor is useless.

Your doctor is only good for prescribing testosterone, beyond that you are on your own. Your doctor will refuse AI’s and HCG in conjunction with TRT, AI’s and HCG is off label use for men on TRT so doctors are forbidden from combining them with TRT.

Show your doctor the study I provided, see what he says.

You need some labs to help determine a good TRT protocol, pre-TRT SHBG and estrogen being important. If total testosterone was below midrange and estrogen high, weekly injections will only increase estrogen higher causing severe mood problems, erectile issues and low libido. I’m willing to bet your doctor only ordered total testosterone.


So if that’s the case, then where do I get AIs and HCG? What are those used for anyway? How common is it that people need AIs and HCG?


I think he’s gone off his meds a little. HCG is non-prescription in some States, so you can order it online. Your doctor very well might provide them, there are plenty that give them automatically without any actual reason. AI’s are good to have on-hand until you know how you do with things. You probably don’t need any.


I did a little bit of reading, but not too clear on HCG.

From what I understand, it’s used to spark your body’s production of testosterone and sperm, correct? So, does the injection of HCG allow your body to create more T? Or is it just for sperm production? If for sperm production, is it enough to re-produce?

Thanks again man, sorry to bother with all the questions. You guys have been awesome.


HCG is used for fertility while on TRT since TRT suppresses sperm production , AI’s are used to control high estrogen side effects. If you want these, by prepared to pay out of pocket for your TRT, which is probably not bad idea.

FSH when added to HCG can increase sperm production to a greater degree if having trouble on TRT and HCG only. Clomid is used to restart the HTPA and get testosterone production going again, but if the cause of low testosterone is not addressed or do to normal/abnormal aging, your levels will decline again to pre-TRT levels.


It is mimics LH (luteinizing hormone) in your body. This hormone inspires your testicles to produce more, which means test, estrogen and sperm.


Now, what about Clomid? Does that replace anything?


Clomid binds estrogen receptors and fools your body into thinking that your E2 is low. In response the pituitary cranks up the LH and tells your balls to get to work.


I asked my first Dr about HCG. And he had no idea what i was talking about. I think he though it was hgh or something. When explained he said oh you dont need that. TRT doesnt shut you down. Didnt even bother with the AI talk i just found a new Dr


So what’s the difference between that (Clomid) and HCG? Which works better?


The tele clinics, what do they usually start you at if you’re a new patient? Do they usually schedule you out 6 weeks after your first round? Thank you


HCG does not require a pituitary gland to do it’s job


The difference is neither work very well, clomid mostly has lots of side effects, HCG stimulates only half of the testicles and doesn’t work very well most of the time, the latter is a hormone your body evolve to handle and will work.

TRT works better.


I started at 140mg 40mg eod. Labs and consult 3 months out unless you want an earlier one