Anyone using the 5/3/1 for hypertrophy? I know a lot of power lifters are using it and I am curious as if it is a good program for bodybuilding as well. I’ve read the 5/3/1 book but it talks very little about muscle growth apart from suggesting you carefully decided proper acessory exercises to promote muscle building.
If you want to bodybuild to a bodybuilding type of program. Splits, isolation exercises etc.
Side note: no matter which program are you on it’s the food that’s important.
squat day - leg workout
deadlift day - back workout
bench day - chest
MP day - shoulders
You can adapt it for bodybuilding purposes but it isn’t designed with the bodybuilder in mind, it’s a basic strength program.
Up to you really, there’s no reason why you can’t adapt the 5/3/1 program but it locks you into 4 exercises (that may not be suitable for you for bodybuilding purposes) and you’re trying to turn a program into something it isn’t. If it works it works but don’t follow a program (albeit a good one) just because you want to, you need to do what’s right for you and your goals.
It is an effective program for bringing up those 4 lifts so if you grow well off those 4 lifts then yeah it’s a good program FOR YOU.
[quote]ATPsynth wrote:
Anyone using the 5/3/1 for hypertrophy? I know a lot of power lifters are using it and I am curious as if it is a good program for bodybuilding as well. I’ve read the 5/3/1 book but it talks very little about muscle growth apart from suggesting you carefully decided proper acessory exercises to promote muscle building. [/quote]
yeah I am, I’m about to start Cycle 6 in about a week and am still going off of CC’s template. You can divvy it up with a body part split, or like me and just go with a standard upper/lower.
i.e.
Day 1
5/3/1 MP
Chest
Lat width
Triceps (some type of press)
Abs, external rotation work, whatever
Day 2
5/3/1 DL
Biceps
Quad-focused movement (single-leg work, hack squat, leg press, etc)
Hams (optional, but something like back extensions, GHR, various leg curls, etc)
Abs, whatever
Day 3
5/3/1 BP
Upper chest or shoulders work (anything from incline bench to lateral raises)
Back thickness
Triceps (some type of pulldown or another press)
Abs, external rotation, whatever
Day 4
5/3/1 Squat
Biceps/brachialis (hammer curls, pin wheels, etc)
Hamstring movement (rom DLs, etc)
Quad movement as above (optional)
Abs
Not optimal since you are constrained to one bang-for-your-buck exercise for some muscles 1-2x a week, but most would be better off this way with 5/3/1 so you don’t overdo the volume. This split is quite effective though. My best gains have come from it.
I’ve been successfully implementing 5/3/1 into my bodybuilding program.
[quote]Vir wrote:
squat day - leg workout
deadlift day - back workout
bench day - chest
MP day - shoulders
You can adapt it for bodybuilding purposes but it isn’t designed with the bodybuilder in mind, it’s a basic strength program.
Up to you really, there’s no reason why you can’t adapt the 5/3/1 program but it locks you into 4 exercises (that may not be suitable for you for bodybuilding purposes) and you’re trying to turn a program into something it isn’t. If it works it works but don’t follow a program (albeit a good one) just because you want to, you need to do what’s right for you and your goals.
It is an effective program for bringing up those 4 lifts so if you grow well off those 4 lifts then yeah it’s a good program FOR YOU.[/quote]
This is what I’m doing now. Found that I have more gas in the tank for arm work than I usually do (Chest+Bi, Shoulders+Tri). That and doing ‘accessory’ leg work twice a week was unproductive for me, so why not do some rows and chins after DL day.
Btw, you’re not really ‘locked’ into those 4 exercise. Bench can easily be replace by inclines, back with front squats, DLs with RDLs etc. But, to get anywhere you need to stick with those exercises for several cycles.
[quote]austin_bicep wrote:
I’ve been successfully implementing 5/3/1 into my bodybuilding program. [/quote]
Can you post this please? This is really interesting to me since I like the idea of 5/3/1 so you can get your base strength up continually without worrying about regressing for quite some time.
[quote]rundymc wrote:
[quote]Vir wrote:
squat day - leg workout
deadlift day - back workout
bench day - chest
MP day - shoulders
You can adapt it for bodybuilding purposes but it isn’t designed with the bodybuilder in mind, it’s a basic strength program.
Up to you really, there’s no reason why you can’t adapt the 5/3/1 program but it locks you into 4 exercises (that may not be suitable for you for bodybuilding purposes) and you’re trying to turn a program into something it isn’t. If it works it works but don’t follow a program (albeit a good one) just because you want to, you need to do what’s right for you and your goals.
It is an effective program for bringing up those 4 lifts so if you grow well off those 4 lifts then yeah it’s a good program FOR YOU.[/quote]
This is what I’m doing now. Found that I have more gas in the tank for arm work than I usually do (Chest+Bi, Shoulders+Tri). That and doing ‘accessory’ leg work twice a week was unproductive for me, so why not do some rows and chins after DL day.
Btw, you’re not really ‘locked’ into those 4 exercise. Bench can easily be replace by inclines, back with front squats, DLs with RDLs etc. But, to get anywhere you need to stick with those exercises for several cycles.[/quote]
How does doing chins + rows/whatever affect your upper days though, which come before and after the DL or Squat day?
[quote]PB Andy wrote:
[quote]ATPsynth wrote:
Anyone using the 5/3/1 for hypertrophy? I know a lot of power lifters are using it and I am curious as if it is a good program for bodybuilding as well. I’ve read the 5/3/1 book but it talks very little about muscle growth apart from suggesting you carefully decided proper acessory exercises to promote muscle building. [/quote]
yeah I am, I’m about to start Cycle 6 in about a week and am still going off of CC’s template. You can divvy it up with a body part split, or like me and just go with a standard upper/lower.
i.e.
Day 1
5/3/1 MP
Chest
Lat width
Triceps (some type of press)
Abs, external rotation work, whatever
Day 2
5/3/1 DL
Biceps
Quad-focused movement (single-leg work, hack squat, leg press, etc)
Hams (optional, but something like back extensions, GHR, various leg curls, etc)
Abs, whatever
Day 3
5/3/1 BP
Upper chest or shoulders work (anything from incline bench to lateral raises)
Back thickness
Triceps (some type of pulldown or another press)
Abs, external rotation, whatever
Day 4
5/3/1 Squat
Biceps/brachialis (hammer curls, pin wheels, etc)
Hamstring movement (rom DLs, etc)
Quad movement as above (optional)
Abs
Not optimal since you are constrained to one bang-for-your-buck exercise for some muscles 1-2x a week, but most would be better off this way with 5/3/1 so you don’t overdo the volume. This split is quite effective though. My best gains have come from it.[/quote]
On average how long are your workouts? And how do you set up sets/reps for accessory work?
PB Andy’s split looks really good.
You could also split it up in more of a body part split way
like
day 1 (Shoulders, triceps)
MP 5/3/1
Front plate raises
Leaning lat raises
Reverse peck deck flies
Dips
Skullcrushers
Day 2 (Legs)
Squat 5/3/1
Leg press
Lunges
Leg curls
Day 3 (Chest)
Bench 5/3/1
DB incline
Cable cross overs
Flies
Day 4 (Back, biceps)
DL 5/3/1
DB rows
Pull-ups
Straigth arm pulldowns
BB curls
Incline DB curls
Ramping you acc. exercises to a top set of anything between 6-12 reps…
Its possible. You can look at one of the templates in there called the periodization bible, and see that it was made with a bit of a bodypart split in mind. Maybe add in an exercise here or there to bring up a lagging bodypart.
[quote]PHGN wrote:
PB Andy’s split looks really good.
You could also split it up in more of a body part split way
like
day 1 (Shoulders, triceps)
MP 5/3/1
Front plate raises
Leaning lat raises
Reverse peck deck flies
Dips
Skullcrushers
Day 2 (Legs)
Squat 5/3/1
Leg press
Lunges
Leg curls
Day 3 (Chest)
Bench 5/3/1
DB incline
Cable cross overs
Flies
Day 4 (Back, biceps)
DL 5/3/1
DB rows
Pull-ups
Straigth arm pulldowns
BB curls
Incline DB curls
Ramping you acc. exercises to a top set of anything between 6-12 reps…
I like the looks of that split. good work
[/quote]
[quote]forbes wrote:
On average how long are your workouts? And how do you set up sets/reps for accessory work?[/quote]
30-45 minutes; everything ramped to a top set or two
[quote]TheDudeAbides wrote:
[quote]forbes wrote:
On average how long are your workouts? And how do you set up sets/reps for accessory work?[/quote]
30-45 minutes; everything ramped to a top set or two[/quote]
I presume its 5x10 for all (or most accessory) exercises?
[quote]forbes wrote:
[quote]TheDudeAbides wrote:
[quote]forbes wrote:
On average how long are your workouts? And how do you set up sets/reps for accessory work?[/quote]
30-45 minutes; everything ramped to a top set or two[/quote]
I presume its 5x10 for all (or most accessory) exercises?[/quote]
Do you mean BBB 5x10? I haven’t done that in almost a year. I typically do 3-4 sets ramped up to a heavy set which is 6-10 reps.
I was just saying in the 5/3/1 thread how I didn’t think that BBB (Boring But Big) was the best method for hypertrophy … but I’m going to give it a go again. I think BBB squat and deadlift are great for conditioning.
I don’t understand why people use non-bodybuilding programs for bodybuilding. It’s the strangest thing. And it’s so surprising to me that I addressed it in my Bodybuilding Bible thread several times.
I went to Wendlers seminar when he had it in Chicago, and I asked him how would he fit the program for a bodybuilder, and his answer was he could not tell you. What a trainer recommended was to do the main movement, and then add in bodypart specific stuff. That’s why I think that PBAndy’s stuff looks good. It’s split,and it adds in hypertrophy work.
[quote]forbes wrote:
[quote]PB Andy wrote:
[quote]ATPsynth wrote:
Anyone using the 5/3/1 for hypertrophy? I know a lot of power lifters are using it and I am curious as if it is a good program for bodybuilding as well. I’ve read the 5/3/1 book but it talks very little about muscle growth apart from suggesting you carefully decided proper acessory exercises to promote muscle building. [/quote]
yeah I am, I’m about to start Cycle 6 in about a week and am still going off of CC’s template. You can divvy it up with a body part split, or like me and just go with a standard upper/lower.
i.e.
Day 1
5/3/1 MP
Chest
Lat width
Triceps (some type of press)
Abs, external rotation work, whatever
Day 2
5/3/1 DL
Biceps
Quad-focused movement (single-leg work, hack squat, leg press, etc)
Hams (optional, but something like back extensions, GHR, various leg curls, etc)
Abs, whatever
Day 3
5/3/1 BP
Upper chest or shoulders work (anything from incline bench to lateral raises)
Back thickness
Triceps (some type of pulldown or another press)
Abs, external rotation, whatever
Day 4
5/3/1 Squat
Biceps/brachialis (hammer curls, pin wheels, etc)
Hamstring movement (rom DLs, etc)
Quad movement as above (optional)
Abs
Not optimal since you are constrained to one bang-for-your-buck exercise for some muscles 1-2x a week, but most would be better off this way with 5/3/1 so you don’t overdo the volume. This split is quite effective though. My best gains have come from it.[/quote]
On average how long are your workouts? And how do you set up sets/reps for accessory work?[/quote]
Including warm-ups and if I don’t have to wait for the rack, about an hour.
I ramp to a final top set like TheDudeAbides (awesome name btw), and depending on the exercise, I shoot for a range of reps and try to get more weight or more reps next week (like DC basically). So for Brachialias, I’ll do 12-20 SS (12-20 reps straight set). For accessory BB bench, I’ll do 5-8 SS, for DB bench, I may go higher, something like 8-12 SS. For back thickness, 6-10 SS, back width 8-15 SS.
On squat day (more quads involved the way I squat), I am doing it a bit complicated for hamstrings in terms of accessory work. For 1-2 cycles, I’ll go off of Strength Training, Bodybuilding & Online Supplement Store - T NATION , and do one category for higher reps for a couple cycles, then switch that and do the same category for lower reps. I then do the same thing on DL day but with different categories (since my Hams don’t get hit that much with Deadlifts, not enough of a stretch).
Quad accessory is usually in the 8-15 rep range, and I do rest pause sometimes but with smaller body parts (biceps and triceps, and sometimes chest).
hey bblb, I was there too haha (if you are talking about the most recent one).
[quote]TheDudeAbides wrote:
[quote]forbes wrote:
[quote]TheDudeAbides wrote:
[quote]forbes wrote:
On average how long are your workouts? And how do you set up sets/reps for accessory work?[/quote]
30-45 minutes; everything ramped to a top set or two[/quote]
I presume its 5x10 for all (or most accessory) exercises?[/quote]
Do you mean BBB 5x10? I haven’t done that in almost a year. I typically do 3-4 sets ramped up to a heavy set which is 6-10 reps.
I was just saying in the 5/3/1 thread how I didn’t think that BBB (Boring But Big) was the best method for hypertrophy … but I’m going to give it a go again. I think BBB squat and deadlift are great for conditioning.[/quote]
I’m not a big fan of BBB either. I hate doing multiple sets at the same weight anyways.