T Nation

41 Year Old Starting T Therapy


#1

Hey all. I am 41 and just started T therapy. I have had prior experience in the gym, over a decade which included b/f in 7-12% continuous ranges). Fast forward a few years and I haven't trained AT ALL and fell to 217 and 33%+!!! I lacked fire and motivation while craving sappy movies and pizza. I had become a bitch.

Hit up the dr and T came back at 168!!! I started crying and asked for a Bon Bon. Here are my labs, my protocol, diet, and training schedule. Please jump my ass and tell me right or wrong. I haven't trained in some time and am basically starting as a beginner. Here goes:

41 yrs old
217 lbs. 33%bf
normal hair bodywise but did notice crown hair loss on gel (treated successfully w finesteride
no testicular pain
havent woken to a hardon since I was a teenager but am as horny as one. Did not have issues with getting or
maintaining an erection which I question a bit
Use to be a freak of nature living below 12% bf with crazy energy to the point of hearing about it daily then it
all seemed to end overnight

LABS

Total TEST: 168
Total FREE: not tested

Serum

FSH 3.7 mIU/ml. Ref 1.5-12.4
LH 4.6 mIU/ml. 1.7-8.6

EDTA Whole Blood

WBC 6.1. X 10E3/uL 3.4-10.8
RBC 4.61 x 10E6/uL. 4.14-5.80
Hemo 15.2 g/dL. 12.6-17.7
HCT 44.5%. 37.5-51.0 %
MCV. 97 fL. 79-97
MCH 33.0 pg. 26.6-33.0 pg
MCHC 34.2 g/dL. 31.5-35.7
RDW. 13.6%. 12.3-15.4%
PLT. 219 x10E3/uL 150-379

Serum

E 15.6 pg/ml
DHT 19 ng/dL. LOW. ng/dL. * finesteride 1 mg daily (MPB)

Lipid Panel

Chol. 190 mg/dL. 100-199
TriG. 266 mg/dL. HIGH 0-149
HDL. 39. mg/dL. LOW >39
LDL. 98. mg/dL. 0-99
VLDL. 53. mg/dL. HIGH. 5-40

DHT reference range adult male 30-85
E Roche ECLIA methodology
HDL accord to ATP-III guide HDL-C >59 negative risk CHD

PROTOCOL

Prescribed (5) bottles 10 ml Test Cyp for 6 months protocol
** definitely way more than needed

200 mg Test Cyp Inject weekly (self)

  • can split in half for 2 x a week
  • not worried about shrinkage
  • doc wants blood test and to see me in 6 months
  • doc said if I notice symptoms of E to come in for blood test to see if I need so

CURRENT BODY COMP:

5'8"  217  33+ bf

DIET:
cut fat managing muscle loss

2025 cals.      202.5 P.     202.5 C.     45 F

SUPPS

 Multi-v
 Fish oil
 Legion Pulse pre-workout
 Legion Phoenix
 BCAAS + yohimbine (fasted training days)

SCRIPTS (aside from T)

 Finesteride 1mg daily for baldness. Fighting the good fight

TRAINING:

HIIT 3x weekly
Weight Training 5x's a week
BLS Workout 3sets 5 rep range

Obviously my shit is all fucked up and I need to move my numbers back to where they should be. Let it rip and thx!


#2

Kind of a strange doc you have there. I might need to get a referral!

Anyway, read the stickies. 200 mg a week is lot, but not unheard of. You may very well not need that much. I’d bet anything you’re going to have E issues. You’re taking a lot of T and you’ve got a lot of fat to aromitize it. It’s likely to show up. Remember, you can have E problem without growing tits. Have an AI ready and get labs done in 4-6 weeks to check.

If you’ve been fit in the past, you know how to eat, but you’re older. You’ll have to be more strict than before. Losing weight and hard training will help the lipids.

Your body knows what it’s like to be lean. You’ll have a big head start on the ’ normal’ guy. Just stick to it.


#3

Did problems with T levels seem to start with finasteride?

There are 7 stickies, not tagged.
Start with advice for new guys.

  • note first paragraph

Protocol for injections describes injections with insulin syringes and SC as an alternative to IM

Do your labs 1/2 way between injections, always.

200mg may be too much, you may not get balanced.


#4

Awesome to hear from you both! definitely on point and to have KSman appear was tits; no pun intended. I worried about the fat aromatization as well and my dr did tell me to inject on monday and that he wants a blood test done on a thursday. he wants E and free test results only. to his credit he did say I know my body better than he ever will and it will be a long road of trial and error.

his main things were to train right, eat right, and sleep right while laying off the alcohol. all straight advice in my book. he did offer hcg or an ai if I feel it is necessary but wanted to wait for a couple weeks of injects and a blood test before adding to the regimen. his main point was a lot of things can fill a tire and turn off the warning lights but all it really required was air. hmmphhh.

He did give me 22g 1 1/2" and said my wife, an er nurse, should be well versed at doing the injects. this contradicts orher info…

KSMan thanks for taking time as well. these are full if new guys on test posts and its gotta get crazy answering em all. I did read the stickies and will continue to reread. there is a ton of info above my head in there. i do plan on keeping this thread updated with my experience as everyone else seems to dump off.

any and all info/advice is GREATLY appreciated and as always brutal honesty is king!


#5

sorry KSMan forgot to answer your q. no the T issue started about 5 years ago as best as I can tell looking back. i started originally on gel over a year ago and quit 3 months in to it as my hair was comin out in more clumps than a ghetto chick extensions fight not to mention the 15 lbs I packed on in a HURRY. i jumped off gel, swore off trt and started fin. a year later here I am…

I never really got morning wood, libido is same so far on and off trt (has always been crazy), erections are the same and I dont feel any more “energized” as of yet. What else should I be looking for as far as hightened levels of E go?

I have read a ton on taking Finesteride while on TRT Protocol. whats your guys opinions?

Should I be supplementing with anything else such as Vitamin D or DHEA?

Thanks for the help everyone and I will be sure to check others posts.


#6

There is no need for 1.5" needles and all of the discomfort and decades of muscle damage. Use 1/2" #29 0.5ml insulin syringes - see the [protocol for injections sticky].

Is T cyp 100mg/ml or 200mg/ml?

Start with advice for new guys.

  • note first paragraph <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
    Low thyroid function lowers metabolic rate and if you don’t burn lipids and sugars in your blood, the fat cells will take them in.
    Check your body temperatureS as per the sticky. You need to be using iodized salt.

#7

KSMan you really need to start a company where you can review peoples numbers and protocol and make suggestions. Your advice is spot on. I’m gonna start the Thyroid check tomorrow morning and record my numbers for a week to see where I am at. I also agree with the needles being excessive and will address that with my doctor as well. the Test Cyp is 200mg so I am prescribed 1cc of 200 mg test cyp weekly. I want to ensure my DHEA and Iodine levels are good and I know that the last few years of gobbling up processed crap made my body find clorine and bromine instead of the needed iodine. I have addressed this in my diet and have set tomorrow as D day. Hopefully, I will see improvement and it wont result in the brain damage associated with thyroid issues…lol. my q’s:

is there anything I can supplement that will “cleanse” adrenals and thyroid?

I worry about my adrenals because I have taken some sort of thermogenic most of the last 10 years or so. I now realize it was just masking the symptoms of a much larger issue but, I fear that I may have caused major damage to my adrenal glands.


#8

High dose iodine will displace bromines. As that occurs, if there is a bromine load, the free bromines are excreted. During that process, one can stink and feel unwell.

In most jurisdictions, you can get insulin syringes without an Rx. Why ask doc about that? Your wife can show you how to do SC injections.


#9

ahhh…i was unaware that insulin needles werent part of a script. Im in Ohio amd always thought they were. Ill get a box and give it a go. do you have any advice in adrenal detox or is it even a “thing”? otherthan bitch tits amd general feeling of malaise, which I have now anyway, is there another telltale sign of high e convergence?


#10

[quote]TOG wrote:
KSMan you really need to start a company where you can review peoples numbers and protocol and make suggestions. Your advice is spot on. [/quote]

There is something to this, but ultimately what KSMan does could land him in hot water. It’s essentially providing medical advice without a license, and it could be seen as illegal. The truth of the matter is that he is more informed than 95% of the people that are licensed. It’s an ironic situation.


#11

True on all of that. i am sure there is a way to make suggestions based on current numbers with a long ass disclaimer. It would be nice to have someone who actually knows what they are talking about and clearly have a love for it.


#12

I make suggestions that guys should feel empowered to implement. I provide the understanding as best that can so guys know what they want and are not blindly doing what I suggest. This fits the norm of a self help forum and is not materially different from thyroid, diabetic or other condition specific forums.

Any time that an Rx drug is involved, its obvious that there is an existing connection point to a doctor and my advice needs to be translated into getting the doctor involved or finding a new doctor. So that is the ethical/legal gate keeper.