can someone help me find the article “Running Man” I did a search but can’t find it.
Thanks,
I am in fact not a smart aleck, I was just correcting him. Greatgro said 12 MPH was half speed, would that not imply top speed for 400m is 24 MPH, breaking the WR. BTW I am a damned fine quarter miler, so to be called a smart aleck by someone who neither knows more than me or has more experience on a subject is a bit of a joke.
Anyways, 400m repeats are nowhere near sprint training. The workout he was doing was more of a mile pace than sprints, so I don’t think you should dump on the guy. Unless you can easily so 400 repeats in 70 seconds with little rest on a treadmill.
I’m going to try and find a track to run on tomorrow. I’m going to use my HRM and stopwatch. What is a decent time to complete these 400m set in? What should I shoot for? I’m going to rest 90-120 seconds each.
[quote]pkradgreek wrote:
i can not see it possible to run at 95% intensity and rest only 60 seconds and repeat the same performance. I know i’m out of shape when it comes to those longer distances (400meters) when it comes to repeat performance, but that would be a close 1:1 of force output time to rest, and you are talking about heavy glycogen depletion. I tried the one minute intervals using my 40lb weight vest and 15 degree incline on the treadmill running at 10 minute mile pace and it would take me over 3minutes to bring my heart rate back down. I’ve done sprint intervals where my heart rate has easily gone over 195. laters pk[/quote]
The point is to run at 95% capacity, not necessarily 95% of your total first output. If you find you are running the 5th or 6th 400 w/in 5% of your first time, you did not run your first few 400’s as hard as you should. Your time will gradually degrade over the 6 400’s, the important thing is to push your body to it’s full capacity and give maximum effort.
If you run your first 400 at 50 seconds, I would not expect you to run your last at less than 65 seconds. When I run these, I note my first 400 time, then set a goal of the next 400 w/in 3-5 seconds. I continue to do this throughout the session until completion.
The most important thing I have found is if you are taking a 60 sec. break btwn 400’s, make sure your butt is running the moment that 60 sec. is up. If not, you ARE NOT getting the full effect intended of this “exercise”.
[quote]JDREDD wrote:
pkradgreek wrote:
i can not see it possible to run at 95% intensity and rest only 60 seconds and repeat the same performance. I know i’m out of shape when it comes to those longer distances (400meters) when it comes to repeat performance, but that would be a close 1:1 of force output time to rest, and you are talking about heavy glycogen depletion. I tried the one minute intervals using my 40lb weight vest and 15 degree incline on the treadmill running at 10 minute mile pace and it would take me over 3minutes to bring my heart rate back down. I’ve done sprint intervals where my heart rate has easily gone over 195. laters pk
The point is to run at 95% capacity, not necessarily 95% of your total first output. If you find you are running the 5th or 6th 400 w/in 5% of your first time, you did not run your first few 400’s as hard as you should. Your time will gradually degrade over the 6 400’s, the important thing is to push your body to it’s full capacity and give maximum effort.
If you run your first 400 at 50 seconds, I would not expect you to run your last at less than 65 seconds. When I run these, I note my first 400 time, then set a goal of the next 400 w/in 3-5 seconds. I continue to do this throughout the session until completion.
The most important thing I have found is if you are taking a 60 sec. break btwn 400’s, make sure your butt is running the moment that 60 sec. is up. If not, you ARE NOT getting the full effect intended of this “exercise”.[/quote]
I don’t mean to sound obnoxious or be a smart aleck but what is the reasoning behind this? It is contrary to the way I train-usually trying to hit the same time for each rep, the last reps usually requiring more effort. Are these actually all out efforts for each 400m rep? It just sounds too painful to me, a 50 sec 400m runner, only capable of 65 on the last one.
[quote]heron wrote:
can someone help me find the article “Running Man” I did a search but can’t find it.
Thanks,[/quote]
After hours of relentless searching I have it here for you.
http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do;?id=459414
Oh and by the way… YOU’RE WELCOME!
(In best NiCk Burns your Companies computer guy voice)
When I was getting a client ready for specail forces selection I had him do 1 kilometer sprints with a rest ratio of
1:1
These really killed him but I was trying to teach him how to stay relaxed throughout the process even when he wanted to quit. Train hard fight easy has always been the motto of the SAS and thats how I trained him. Obviously I had him doing Kettlebell work, ruck marching, push-ups and pull-ups.
Another great cardio drill to do is what i know as figure eights. go to a beach and get your arse down to the sand and sprint for 400 meters once you have done that jog in the water for 400 meters, now get out of the water and sprint for another 400 hundred meters, now jog in the water for 400 meters.
Once you have completed a figure eight do the following push-up complex
regular push-ups x RM (rep max)
one legged wide push-ups x RM
hindu push ups x RM
at the end of the next figure eight do the following complex
Russian twists x RM
crunches x RM
Hindu squats x RM
Remember that this is what was done in the Australian Army. I do recal many ‘hefty’ soldiers getting very lean after doing these for a month.
Simon
[quote]greatgro wrote:
LarryJr wrote:
Today I attempted to do 400-meter sprints on a treadmill as described in Christian Thibaudeau’s Running Man article. I ended up doing about six 400m sprints…a few of them I didn’t make it all the way because I was going too fast. I only rested about 60 seconds between each one.
Talking about a tough workout…I though I was going to puke.
What am I missing here? Most treadmills only go to 10mph, a few maybe to 12mph. That’s not fast! That’s not even half speed! 10MPH is a 6 minute-mile. Not every one can do that but you should be able to run at a 6 min mile pace for only a 1/4 of a mile (400m). I don’t get it. I must be missing something here…
[/quote]
As someone else posted, the times for endurance events are getting much closer to times for sprint events once you get it down to the same distance. More advances have been made in maintaining top speeds for longer periods vs. increasing top speed. The other problem with saying this is not fast is that Larry is being compared to very elite athletes; i.e. world record holders. There may be some on this forum that can approach those types of numbers, but they are few and far between. Most olympians don’t get too close to the world record times. Your average male is going to be considered very fast if he can achieve the sprint times of female olympic sprinters.
[quote]elars21 wrote:
I don’t mean to sound obnoxious or be a smart aleck but what is the reasoning behind this? It is contrary to the way I train-usually trying to hit the same time for each rep, the last reps usually requiring more effort. Are these actually all out efforts for each 400m rep? It just sounds too painful to me, a 50 sec 400m runner, only capable of 65 on the last one. [/quote]
It’s not obnoxious, just a good question. These are all out efforts, but are most likely to be approx. 95% of your capacity for EACH 400. Why save for the last 2 or 3 rather than giving it all you have in this type of exercise. My experience has also been that if you are giving your all, unless you are an Olympic caliber runner, it is imposible to run the same time giving the same effort for all 6 400’s (given that the rest interval is not too long).
As for it being too painful, it is a stress to your system, which is why it is so effective. Your legs will burn and your lungs will probably be on fire. Think of it this way, could you complete your 1 rep max bench 6 times in a row with only a 60 sec. interval? Probably not, you would have to lower the weight slightly each time to complete each rep. Similarly, your time decreases slightly after each 400 if you are giving maximum effort.
this is a great idea
i have a treadmill too and i never use it for short distances
guess it jus slips the mind
but im gonna do these 400 meter things now
and see how much speed i can pick up
i always use an incline, most of the time 15 degrees, when using a treadmill because a flat surface is a damn joke. Basically all you have to do is hop up and the ground moves underneath you instead of you having to push forward like when you are running on a stationary surface.
this is my take on things:
if your goal is to improve in a certain distance interval then all your efforts should be above 90% intensity with your rest periods dictated by your own heart rate going back to a predetermined baseline. I like to use walking at a slow pace heart rate. This gives enough time for glycogen replensihment and neural fatigue management. I suggest walking to maintain blood flow in the appropriate muscles.
if your goal is to improve athletic performance for your sport, for instance if you are a hockey player and your shift lasts for 45 seconds and your usual rest period is 135seconds then follow along those parameters with your goal being to maintain as high an intensity as possible even if it means that there will be a performance drop. This will force your body to increase its power output and recovery ability while allowing you to maintain a high enough intensity level while emulating real world conditions. your goal here is to increase the distance traveled in a given amount of time.
what do you guys think? laters pk
Just got back from the cardiologist to go over my stress test and echo on my heart. I’m not sure if 400m sprints are going to work for me. I guess I have thickening of the heart walls from being real fat at one time and having high blood pressure.
He said he wants me to do 30 minutes of cardio 5 days a week. He said that this may reverse the damage over time. So I’m not sure sprints are going to work since I can’t do them for 30 minutes. I wonder if I could get away with doing sprints on lifting days and running 30 minutes on the others. I see the dr again in a month. I may try this and see what he says about it in a month.
Larry Jr
That much could lead to overtraining, or at the very least some type of lack of recovery effect. Just incorporate some HIIT or sprint work into your everyday cardio. This will be better for you anyways. Vary it by day, but you could cardio for 5 min. then do an interval of either speed or incline, then rest predtermined amount of time.
Check with your dr. first. But lets say you incorporate 2,3,5,10 whatever burst and you mix that into your total cardio time. And for goodness sake, take time during the week to REST
How does this look? I’m currently on Chad’s TBT:
Monday: Lift & Sprint
Tuesday: Run 3 miles (10 min miles)
Wednesday: Lift
Thursday: Run 3 miles
Friday: Lift & brisk walk up hill 30 min
Sat: Run 3 miles or sprint
Sun: OFF
[quote]LarryJr wrote:
How does this look? I’m currently on Chad’s TBT:
Monday: Lift & Sprint
Tuesday: Run 3 miles (10 min miles)
Wednesday: Lift
Thursday: Run 3 miles
Friday: Lift & brisk walk up hill 30 min
Sat: Run 3 miles or sprint
Sun: OFF[/quote]
Maybe take Thursday off as well? You know your level of fitness better than I, but with TBT and running, that is 6 days in a row for legs. Could lead to overtraining possibly. Just something to consider and evaluate as you progress through your workouts. Keep a log on how you feel and how tired or not you are also. Remember to consider your CNS recovery as well. A TBT workout can have an aerobic effect as well so it is fairly taxing if performed to specs. Good luck–keep pounding
I think I’ll try that with Thursday and Sunday off. Good thinking. I log all of my workouts and will start logging my cardio sessions. When I go back to the cardiologist in a month, I will see what he thinks. I wear a HRM during cardio so I think I will keep track of my HR too.
I just worry about not making good gains because of all the cardio. OH well…have to take care of the old ticker or else…
Absolute most important muscle. Keep it healthy first and foremost. Maybe it will lead to smaller gains over longer periods. WHO CARES! It’s about a lifestyle man. You should be training to be the best you can be, not compared to some ideal. Life’s a journey-not a destination
Proper kudos to Aerosmith for that one. Rock on.
In order to get FASTER, you need to focus on shorter sprints, 40-100M with more rest.
To increase the time you can STAY at near maximal output, you need to do 200-300-400-500-600M interval work with shorter rest periods, definately not allowing your heart rate to fully drop to normal levels.
To increase your endurance, or your ability to hold a set pace for more and more distance or time, you need to do just that, put miles under your belt.
I was never a good 100 meter runner because my initial power or starting power was not very good, if you want to improve this, lift heavy weights.
IMO 52 seconds is not really that fast for an all out 400 meter time, 52 seconds would not even place you in one of our high school invitationals. I do come from a fast area though, the only school in NYS to beat our team when I was a senior had a kid named Lubert Lewis running for them. He ran around a 46 second 400 Meter. That is damn Fast. He also went on to run in the olympic qualifiers a few years later though he did not make the olympic team, (guys like Micheal Johnson did). If you can run about 55 seconds, you are in good shape but probably not very naturally gifted to run a 400 meter. Or, you are naturally gifted but are not in very good form. Just a couple of observations.
V
hey…I was jogging with my girlfriend tonight to keep her company at the gym (it was an off day for me) and I decided to try the 400m thing just for kicks. It’s definately tough.
I only did 2 400m at 8 mph (I’m not in great shape).
What do you do for the rest part? Do you just jump to the side, then stand there for 60 seconds or do you quickly hit the down button and walk for 60 seconds or what? I just tried quickly hitting the down button, but the machine doesn’t slow down fast enough for me lol. I was dead tired after the second one.
The treadmills at my gym have a pause button. I just paused the machine until I was ready to go again.