T Nation

4-4 Strong Words


#1

There is no female Mozart because there is no female Jack the Ripper. -- Camille Paglia

What about Eileen Wuornos?

Can we please stop with the Camille Paglia Strong Words? Or perhaps rename them to Man Hating Estrogen Filled Words?

She is so full of shit.


#2

Amen.


#3

I concur. That idiot is trying too hard and comes off as vengefull and caught up in her pwn bs.


#4

I'm at a loss. Does she mean that women aren't poetic, musically talented or capable of serial killings? I think society has proved that wrong on several accounts.


#5

I find the Mozart/Jack the Ripper comparison to be doubly damning for woman. Mozart was a musical genius and she's admitting that there never was a woman his equal.

The Jack the Ripper part is meant as a dig against men, to show that men can also be a lot more cruel/mean than women can; but Jack the Ripper was never caught; he taunted Scotland Yard in letters and he's still remembered today. An evil, misguided asshole he might have been, he stil was smart and good at what he did.

Camille Paglia appears to be saying that no woman ever does anything with enough passion to be remembered by history for it. She's still wrong, but in a sad way.


#6

Exactly. She manages to insult both men and women with one quote and she gets it wrong.

I think TC needs to put away his Big Book of Paglia Quotes and Witticisms.


#7

Maybe if she keeps on hating men with such passion she'll be remembered for all time...


#8

Agreed. The point of the strong words thing is to inspire. I dont see how this is inspiring to women or men.


#9

I think the point of the Mozart/Ripper quote is that men are both capable of great inhumanities and great humanties - if it was said by anyone else it wouldn't have the feminist undercurrent attatched, and would be a more interesting idea.

Remember, even Hitler was a good painter. Inhuman/Human in one man.


#10

BTW TC, please don't take this as whiny criticism of this site, authors or Biotest products.

Just whiny criticism of a dumb quote.


#11

I don't see what's insulting to men about it. She's saying that good or bad, some men accomplish memorable things. The only ones insulted by it should be women as they're the ones who, according to Paglia, can't attain greatness.


#12

Honestly, i dont even get it. Really. Someone explain please.


#13

I'm with you in this one Zap.


#14

I think she uses Jolly Jack not as an example of a smart killer but merely as an example that men are capable of great and senseless violence and women are not. I find this insulting to men.

And of course the passion that makes men killers can also make the geniuses. Women of course cannot be geniuses. This is insulting to women.


#15

Even I don't get the point of this quote and I've been accused on this site of being a man-hater.

Here are some better quotes:

Margo Kaufman:
The only thing worse than a man you can't control is a man you can.

Kathleen Casey:
Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.

Gloria Steinem:
Most women's magazines simply try to mold women into bigger and better consumers.

Eleanor Roosevelt:
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.

Rita Mae Brown:
The reward for conformity is everyone likes you but yourself.

Pauline Thomason:
Love is blind ? marriage is the eye-opener.

Gilda Radner:
I base my fashion taste on what doesn't itch.

Monica Lewinsky:
(On CNN's "Larry King Live", discussing her miraculous weight loss) I've learned not to put things in my mouth that are bad for me.

Rita Rudner:
I got kicked out of ballet class because I pulled a groin muscle. It wasn't mine.

I could go on and on......


#16

Gojira those are good quotes.


#17

How about a view from an opposite side?

I found myself agreeing pretty much wholesale with the 4/4 Strong Words, but on a different account.

It becomes sometimes apparent that, in order to reach the peaks of inspiration, the heights of human intelligence, the most comprehensive vistas of understanding, the greatest accomplishments, one has to be able to embrace pretty much all aspects of consciousness - and that includes the darkest depths of the reptilian brain and all the rest of the evolutionary baggage that we're dragging. This has been the experience of many inspired artists; also a stereotype that testifies for this view is that of the tormented genius. Also, the biographies of many brilliant people and greatest achievers from all fields are often peppered with episodes that would amount for sheer insanity if occuring in "normal" individuals, except in these cases they were all but "normal" - they were geniuses.

Therefore, in my opinion:
If anything, the 4/4 Strong Words are actually an appreciation for the dashing, bold, often reckless masculine spirit - it's what enables the highest of accomplishments, but it's also what keeps its carriers close to the edge of rather undesireable experiences.
Maybe these words were framed as a bitter remark by C. Paglia - I don't know, I'm not familiar with what she did or who she was, but even regardless of the context, this quote strikes me as deeply true.

Two thumbs up for the 4/4 Strong Words.


#18

You're only allowed one thumb. You need to find another reviewer who'll supply the second one.


#19

Yes, I understand what she means by it, but the irony is that everyone knows who Mozart and Jack the Ripper are, but if you ask around, just about no one knows who Camille Paglia is. Neither can anyone, off the top of their head, name a famous female composer or famous female serial killer. On my informal test of one person at the office, I got "Céline Dion" and "Cruella De Ville"... WTF???

That's why it seems that she's (inadvertently maybe) saying that men are capable of greater passions than women are.

She might be right too.


#20

Other quotes by woman:

"Only the weak attempts to accomplish what he knows he can already achieve." - Stella Juarez, Author

"If you are hurt, whether in mind or body, don't nurse your bruises. Get up and light-heartedly, courageously, good temperedly get ready for the next encounter. This is the only way to take life - this is also 'playing' the game!" - Emily Post

"There is nothing we cannot live down, rise above, and overcome." - Ella Wheeler Wilcox

"Being defeated is often a temporary condition. Giving up is what makes it permanent." - Marilyn vos Savant, Columnist

"Hidden deep within the disappointment of our utmost failures and the tremble of our darkest fears are our highest achievements and greatest acts of courage. - Stella Juarez, Author