37 & Need Advice on Potentially Starting HRT - Blood Work Included

That’s funny! And so true. Just as long as you don’t take away my barbells and my testosterone…

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Myth start a log if you get off. I would love to track how you do. Good luck.

Be sure to get labs right B4 u get off.

Everything

Lipids
CBC
Metabolic panel
Igf
Dhea s
Testosterone numbers
Thyroid panel
Prolactin
Ferritin
Estradiol
Shbg

Check blood pressure a few time a day for a few days before you get off.

Hi Guys,

I converted to a different measure for ease of reference

Testosterone:
544ng/dL

SHBG:
1124ng/dL

May I ask, is it the free Androgen Index that matters? If so, isn’t being at 48.5 on a normal scale of 25 to 130 pretty bad?

Yes, or free testosterone. Free testosterone is more important than the total as that is what is bioavailable and able to bind to the receptor sites and do the good things testosterone does. Your SHBG is on the higher side, which means you’ll need a higher total test level (or lower SHBG level) to get your free testosterone higher.

Free Androgen Index is useless and has no diagnostic value, therefore doesn’t guide your doctors decision on TRT protocols in any way, Total T, Free T, estrogen and SHBG do.

Question for you, because I know you’ve utilized hcg at larger doses than most here successfully.

Have you ever experienced, seen, or heard anyone responding poorly to hcg with regard to side effects, specifically water retention, hypertension, insomnia? If so, any strategies for coping besides a reduced dose?

My friend and I who go to the same doc have never had a negative side effect from HCG. I use three times as much as him. Another guy I know with four kids (two of them with the aid of HCG, never had any either.

I’ve ONLY read about negative side effects on the internet and as harsh as this sounds, I think most are from other drugs or the result of hypochondriasis, in the same way that I think supposed palpable differences are well being are experienced from injecting T once per week.

My experience as well. I personally know a lot of guys on TRT and most do weekly. I’ve even come across a few doing every two weeks. One, my brother-in-law who I just found out over the holidays is on TRT and has been for years. It is through his internist, twice a month dosing. I asked him a few questions about it, he is pretty clueless) and he stated he was feeling great. Go figure. I don’t know, maybe he does not know any differently and would feel better with weekly dosing.

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I think 200 twice a month is a bit of a stretch and that’s the reason many docs don’t recommend that. The peaks and valleys are too much. The person starts after the injection with an abnormally high T value and in two weeks below normal. I’m fine with once a week. Some guys act as if a day or two at 400 is actually going to effect overall well being.

Not in my case. I’ve tried hcg numerous times with only trt (80-100mgs per week) with as little as 70ius hcg eod eventually leading to my symptoms. There’s something else going on. Multiple substances or being a hypochondriac does not apply to me, nor is it likely that so many on this board and other forums have experienced similar findings. Too bad. Thought you may have some mechanistic insight.

What side effect did you experience?

Most noticeable is acute water retention beginning two hours post hcg injection and peaking around 24 hours. The severity is dependent on the dose. I’ve never injected more than 500 ius at once. That results in the fastest response. I go from an angular face to approaching moon face, it’s quite dramatic. I’ve done as low as 50-70 ius twice per week and the side effects lessen but are still present and seem to slowly accumulate over time. At this dose however there seems to be little benefit from an atrophy standpoint. These side effects occur without any dietary or training changes as well…

Right, 50 to 70 IU’s twice per week will likely do nothing. Did you use HCG for fertility?

Besides your face where did you experience edema? It would have to be pretty significant for there to be a discernible difference in your appearance. But if you say you experienced it, I won’t question it.

I’ve used it to prevent testicular atrophy. My wife and I aren’t having more kids, but I’ve been attempting to preserve their size for aesthetics and for some of the small amount of pregnenalone they produce (mine has come back low on multiple tests and while I could just supplement, preventing the atrophy altogether is like killing two birds with one stone.)

The edema is systemic but most noticeable in my face and midsection. In relatively lean, not close to contest lean but between 13-15% body fat. I’m around 205 and have visible abs, trained since I was 15, I’m 36 now and have been on hrt for over 5 years.

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I believe it may somehow be related to this:

https://www.discountedlabs.com/blog/post/the_role_of_aldosterone_acth_a/

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Hcg causing moonface? Isn’t that e2 issue?

Well, it’s a water retention issue really, can be caused by a lot of things, including elevated E2, which can be caused by HCG.

Could be a salt issue as well.

Makes sense. It’s not permanent so that’s relieving :slight_smile:

It happens too fast for it to be estrogen conversion from slight increase in T. There’s a lot of other men on this forum and others over the years reporting the same issues with hcg.

I’ve been digging deeper and believe I’ve found out what may be happening to those who don’t respond well to hCG. I’m now seeing evidence that some of us may just be “hcg hyper responders” similar to how some are extremely sensitive to AI’s.

I believe that this cascade of hormones is being activated by those who are sensitive to hcg which is causing the side effecs:

Search results for: 'blog post the_role_of_aldosterone_acth_a' 2

Here are some studies linking LH to these being hyper activated:

https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article/91/3/1136/2843604

Is this a shift for you? I remember having some heated discussions regarding HCG, lol.