T Nation

2nd Cycle Designd ,Opinions!!!!

This is something i have kind of sorted for now,for my 2nd cycle.
D-Bol 30mg ed
Test Enanthate 500mg/week
Eq 400mg/week
D-bol 40mg ed(week4& 5 )
EQ 400mg/week
Winny 50mg/eod
HCG 5000 I.U. week5 & week7
Nolva 20mged(weeks 1-8)

Would this help me put on 10-12lbs of lean mass.In my previous cycle i gaind about 10lbs of LM.
Also would like to kno if i need to incorporate Winny from week 5-8 @100mg/eod to retain gains from weeks 1-4.
I am not sure about how and where i should start proviron?Should i run it @50mg/ed for the entire cycle?Suggestions.

I would do the higher level of d-bol in the first three weeks because the test ent. will not be active yet. I would also drop the eq altogether due to the length of the cycle and start taking 50-70 mg/day winny weeks 5-8.

I am looking for LM Gains and i don’t want to experience the joint pains i experienced in my previous cycle from winny ,alon,usage.Also why would you suggest droppin EQ altogether.

Due to the length of the cycle. If you really want to do it you will need to frontload 800mg on week one. Undecyclenate is one of the slowest releasing esters and is best suited for longer bulking cycles of 10-12 weeks. Also for a second cycle I don’t know if it’s really needed considering the d-bol and winny on top of the test. If you are quite lean and need size the eq will help, but otherwise I wouldn’t worry about it. Personally I would be inclined to do something more like this:
Week 1-4: 500mg/wk test ent.,40mg/ed d-bol, 100mg/eod tren ace.
Weeks 5-8; 500mg/wk test ent. (or prop), 100mg/eod tren ace.

It would be less expensive and avoid the joint issue while giving as good or better results.

Hey!tahnks for that cycle u suggested.Justhat i can’t find Tren in this part of the world ans out here EQ is not very expensive at allll.Just let me kno the ideal wekly dosage and i wouldn’t mind extending the cycle by 2-3 weeks to utilise the EQ well.Also the increased appetite that comes with EQ,when supplemened with quality protein in good quantities should ensure suficient lean mass,right!!Also How good is EQ in retaining gains!!Opinions turbogti.

Alright then. Here you go:

Weeks 1-4: 500mg/wk Test, 400mg/wk EQ (800mg/wk 1 only), 40mg/day d-bol.

Weeks 5-6: 500mg/wk Test, 400mg/wk EQ

Weeks 7-8: 500mg/wk Test, 400mg/wk EQ
50mg/ed Winny(eod if injectable)

Weeks 9-10: 500mg/wk Test(prop if possible), 50mg/ed Winny(eod if inj.)

Weeks 11-15: PCT(prop) or 12-16(ent or cyp)

This should leave you about 10-15lbs heavier, harder and more vascular. Let me know if you have any other questions.

I just wanted to chime in and gives props to Turbo for that awsome cycle that you just posted. If I could get EQ here at a price I could afford then that would be a killer 12week lean mass cycle that I would love to try.
mad props

Pl elaborate on the PCT weeks 11-15/weeks 12-16(ent/cyp).i don’t seem to get that part.

If you use Test Propionate during week 9-10, start your PCT week 11.

If you used Test Enanthate or Cypionat, start your PCT week 12. (Because of the longer halftime of the Test being used.)

Hope that cleared it up?

I guess the gains retained after a test enanthte cycle is very poor.Do you think the EQ and the winny could help maintain the gains from Test Enanthate?Also i was contemplating taking HCG from week 7 @5000.I.U. per week.till week 10.and start PCT consisting of Clomid and Nolva .Also i was plannin to run Nolva@20mg and Proviron@50 mg for the entire length of the cycle or should i start after week 4 when the estrogen levels increase substantially.Also if i acn’t retain the gains from Test Enanthate is Sustanon a better alternative.Pl elaborate on these points!!!

Okay. In order:

  1. Winny is a good choice at the end of a cycle as it will keep you hard and vascular while acting as an anti-estrogen by binding to the receptor. Eq does not play a role in retaining your gains, only creating them.

  2. HCG is a good idea as it will fire up your natural test production just in time for PCT. 5000iu/week for the last 3 weeks before PCT would be perfect. Too long or too high a dose will desensitize you to the LH and put you back where you started.

  3. Just use nolva for your PCT. 40mg/day for 2 weeks, then 20mg/day for 2 weeks. Clomid is essentially the same drug only weaker and without the positives of nolva( increases “good” cholesterol while clomid does the opposite).

  4. Don’t use any nolva during unless it is necessary (itchy or puffy nipples). It will only hinder your gains and cost you money. The proviron however is a good idea at 50mg/day during your cycle as it will act as an anti-e and render the test more effective(this is a luxury not a necessity).

  5. Sust is a waste of money. It is designed for HRT where frequent doses at high levels are not needed. Test is test! All an ester does is regulate it’s release into your body. For weekly injections ent. is just as effective yet much less expensive (to keep your levels even more stable you could halve your inj into 250mg/3.5 days). The only reason I recommend prop at the end of the cycle is that it will allow you too maintain high T levels right until the end then clear your system much more quickly so you can begin to recover faster and more effectively.

Oh yeah, thanks DA for the props, nice to know it’s appreaciated. Moose was right about the esters and PCT as well. VN, this is a good second cycle, i’m sure yor results (with proper training and nutrition) should be excellent.

Thanks for that piece of advice,Bro!!
I hada receeding hairline problem 'cos of hair fall during my previous cycle.I would’t want this to aggrevate in this cycle.What acn i do to avoid this and how?i wouldn’t want to go in for Finasteride or Spirinolactone 'cos they might hinder gains,though effective at stopping hair fall.Would something topical like Minoxidil help?

That’s a tricky one. I don’t think minoxidil will help much. I would think finasteride would be your best choice. However, I believe there may be some interaction between the finasteride and proviron as they are both aimed at 5-alpha reductase. I will see if I can find more info and get back to you. Also, I should mention that you should drop the proviron when starting the winny as the two would greatly contribute to a rise in blood pressure.