T Nation

29, Adjusting TRT Dose, Need Advice


#1

Hey guys. Im new here. Thanks for a informative forum.

Background info

I messed around too much with steroids when I was younger, which left me with chronic low T. Ive been trying to medicate my self for the last two years with meds from the black market, because where I live TRT haven’t been available at all.

I luckily found a private clinic, so now Im under administration by a doctor, but I still need to ask a few questions here.

I tryed all kinds of different doses, when I did my self. I never experienced being stable for very long, because of too high doses of T, and therefore too much E, which resulted in me flying through sweet spot when controlling E with Arimidex.

Protocol Im running now for 45 days:

50mg test-e 2x week
250mg hcg 2x week

which seems to have brought me to a ‘stable’ niveau, but not really where I want and need to be. My doctor says I should keep doing this protocol for 6 months, because it can take that much time to really level out.

Estradiol says: 0,14 nmol/L which I converted too 24 pg/mL
(I have read that most guys have the best experience with E at 21.8 - 30.11 pg/mL)

Testosterone says: 22 nmol/L which I converted to 634 ng/dL

I dont really know if my T is too low, my E is too high, or too low.

What advice can you give me?

My energi is like ok, but I still have som fogginess and no libido at all. I can get soft erection, but its nothing like the sweet spot at all.

When I did it alone, i dosed 100mg 2xweek, had a really hard time controlling E with arimidex - but every once in a while I maybe had 3-6 days in a row where I really had the most amazing, refreshing, beastlike feeling which I presume must be the ‘sweet spot’.

Any advice is HIGHLY appreciated, and if I let something out - please just ask.

Thanks a lot guys. Cheers


#2

When you dose anastrozole or make a dose change, it takes a week for your blood levels of anastrozole to become steady. You can’t be making short term changes.

E2 80pmol/L = ~22pg/ml

For TT=634:
When was lab done? Halfway between injections
Was your dosing consistent?
You might need more T.

Please evaluate your thyroid function via last paragraph.

Please read the stickies found here: About the T Replacement Category

  • advice for new guys - need more info about you
  • things that damage your hormones
  • protocol for injections
  • finding a TRT doc

Evaluate your overall thyroid function by checking oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky. Thyroid hormone fT3 is what gets the job done and it regulates mitochondrial activity, the source of ATP which is the universal currency of cellular energy. This is part of the body’s temperature control loop. This can get messed up if you are iodine deficient. In many countries, you need to be using iodized salt. Other countries add iodine to dairy or bread.


#3

Hi KSman. Thanks a lot for the reply. Come to think about it. My current protocol was your advice in one of your replies to another thread if im not mistaking.

Anyways.

I know about these things like thyroid and other stuff that can affect hormones, but thing is, im mentally exhausted over this hormones circus so first of i just wanna try fine-tuning the protocol from you.

Dosing was consistent, and and blood was drawn 2 days after last injection.

Maybe I function better at lets say maybe 900 ng/dL because of my high doses when I abused it, hence I should try adjusting the dose to 75mg 2x week? But that might affect E in a degree that anti-e has to be introduced?

Maybe my current lvl of E is just a tiny bit too high, and I only need to add a little anti-e?

Maybe both my lvls are too low and readjusting testosterone would be a huge success?

As per earlier post my doctor advised me to stay on this lvl for much longer, but he is not really a ‘huge’ expert. I had to convince him hard to make him prescribe me hCG.

Maybe I could try readjusting the dose to 75mg 2x week. Or hell. Maybe even only 60mg?

Cheers


#4

Estradiol says: 0,14 nmol/L which I converted too 24 pg/mL

I think that your conversion is flawed. Please revisit the numbers.

140pmol/L is almost 40pg/ml

You may need anastrozole now and a higher T dose will increase that need.


#5

Oh yeah I see that. Im not that good at converting the numbers. I used the conversion tool on endmemo.com.

Its clearly that I need anti-e now. I used to try controlling with anastrozole, but with no success. Im an overresponder, and besides that it gave some bad sides like blurred vision, backache etc.

Ive got aromasin on hand though.

What would you recommend me to do?

Im thinking maybe 12,5mg e5d? and raising T dose for starters?


#6

@KSman

I would highly appreciate if you could explain how I did convert the numbers wrong.

At endmemo.com, I put in: 0.14 nmol/L and hit calculate and it says: 23.68 pg/mL which is quite good. I dont see where you get 140pmol/L and 40pg/ml from?

Also if you could answer my other questions I would really appreciate it. Struggling hard here. Ive been trying to dial in for over 2 years and its really having a negative effect on my life.Thanks in advance


#7

1pg/ml = 3.671 pmol/L

140 pmol = 140/3.671 = 38.1 pg/ml


#8

Thanks for your reply. I see it now.

Would you advice maybe reducing either T or hCG shots, so hopefully E will come closer to 22pg/mL?

Or will my TT become to low?


#9

Yes, try 75mg T twice a week.
Yes, E2 will get above target. Suggest 1/2mg at time of T injections.

I understand that you are self-medicating. I am trying to help you get a better outcome.

At your age, hCG 250iu SC/SQ EOD should not be considered optional. You could use Nolvadex 20mg EOD or Clomid 25mg EOD as an alternative or when hCG does not travel well. Note that a few guys feel really bad on Clomid and Nolvadex does not have that affect on those guys.

Does this address your concerns?

Remember that low thyroid function can ruin TRT even when TRT is optimal.


#10

@KSman

I am no longer self-medicating, but my TRT doc is not really that informed. He thinks my numbers are fine, but I my self have experienced the sweet spot and this is simply not it.

I only have aromasin at hand - I tried arimidex but it made me feel weird. Hard to explain.

I am not dosing 250iu hCG EOD. I am dosing 50mg test-e and 250iu hCG, same time, twice a week.

I upped the T dose to 75mg, and I have taken 12,5mg aromasin EOD trying to bring E down. First night after dosing aromasin I had uncontrolled erection. Its gone now and I feel like shit. I dont know what the fuck to do.