T Nation

28 Y/O Needing Advice on Starting TRT

#1

Last year I tested at 565ng/DL. I got another test earlier this week for more variables (total test, free test, LH, FSH, estradiol, SBHG), I will have those results whenever I see my doctor next. I realise that 565 isn’t very low, but it could be lower by now and I feel absolutely terrible. I won’t go on listing symptoms of low test that we all know, let’s just assume it’s sufficiently low for what I am about to ask.

I have a number of questions/concerns in beginning self administered TRT. It must be self administered because of the incredible amounts of regulation in my country which prevent men from getting the help they need.

  1. How did you come to learn so much about testosterone and TRT? Is there any book you can recommend?
  2. I go overseas 3 or 4 times a year for about 2 weeks at a time. Therefore I have decided to pin test-u once a week. Due to the half life I think it should be okay if I go 2 weeks or so without dosing.
  3. I intend to use hcg twice a week at X dosage as well as test-u. The aim here is to retain fertility and testicular size. I’ve heard conflicting ideas about if this is a good idea or not. My question is if I use hcg for life at a low enough dosage, do I run the risk that my body becomes desensitised to hcg, therefore it will no longer work and I will run the risk of infertility?
  4. My plan is to use testosterone and hcg for life, what dosage is considered TRT?
  5. I aim to use 100mg a week of test-u, some people have advised me that this is too high, while others have advised me that it is too low and I will in fact lower my test levels. Is there any truth to this?
  6. I am aiming to get to the higher end of the natural level, 800 to 900mg/DL. Is this sustainable throughout my whole life?
  7. In injecting, are there any parts of the quads or glutes to stay away from? I have been warned about hitting a nerve.

Thank you so much for anyone has time to give me some advice.

28 Y/O first blood test right before TRT
28 Y/O first blood test right before TRT
#2

Dr. Abraham Morgentaler “Testosterone for life” and or TOT Bible. Both invaluable.

You can but consistency is your bodies best friend.

HCG isn’t needed right off the bat, it can be used in combination with FSH injections when the time if right. HCG can complicate your TRT protocol and the dialing in process starting out with so many different things at once.

You can also stop TRT and do a restart using clomid for fertility. Most guys are better off without HCG, it can cause a host of symptoms.

This is one only you can answer, but usually 100-160mg weekly, unless a hyper-metabolizer or hyper-exccreter. Most high SHBG men can get away with one and sometime two injections per week is needed, it all depends if your body is sensitive to fluctuating hormone levels. If you are a hypermetabolizer like a few here, EOD may be needed, however this is more rare and not typical.

I’m a low SHBG guy (16-22) and need about 100mg weekly to get a Total T of 500 and Free T right at the top of the ranges.

I advise injecting using 27-29 gauge insulin syringes in the shoulder and quads, it’s the safest besides injecting Sub-Q into love handles. I aromatase more doing Sub-Q and see higher estrogen and lower testosterone.

A word of caution, be sure you have no mineral or vitamins deficiencies, I started TRT with a severe iron deficiency. Also don’t necessarily aim for a number, sure it’s only part of the equation, but so to are symptoms resolution.

I see too many guys asking how do my labs look without a hint of how they feel and fall into a trap of trying to make the numbers look better hoping it will solve their anxieties not do to hormones. Hormones are only partially responsible for our mental state.

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#3

Sustanon would probably be a better choice here. I am assuming that for some reason you are sure that where you are going it is unavailable? If you have a prescription you can bring it with you without an issue.
If you are quad injecting, aim where there’s meat, like outer upper part of the thigh. You are unlikely to hit a nerve, but if you do you will definitely know it.

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#4

Thank you both for your replies.

I realise this but there’s no way around traveling overseas, and when I’m there I can’t bring any testosterone.

That makes sense that it might not be best to take HCG right away, or at all. You don’t want to introduce too many things to the body at once or you won’t be able to see what drug gives you what side effects.

That being said, is there anything other than HCG that can retain my testicular size?

I guess I will start with 100mg of test-u per week and see how it goes.

Sustanon sounds great but I am unable to obtain it. I will never have a prescription so even if I got sustanon I couldn’t take it overseas.

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#5

That’s a useless dose if you’re using Undecanoate. I’m not being difficult here, I’m being honest. You’ll be taking that weekly shot for 2 months before there’s enough in your system to even start to do anything. It’s not Enanthate or Cypionate, it doesn’t get dosed the same way. You take a monster shot of it and see what happens. You figure out with time how often you need to dose it. It is a frequency issue with a long ester more than a quantity issue.

#6

Systemlord!! Need your advice again after reading this topic…iron deficiency?
i\m still trying to figure things out myself, know that shbg is one of the problems but your comment made me look at my blood again.
Transferrine 1.5 g/l low 2.0-4.1
Transferrine saturation 75% high 20%-45%
what does this mean?
Could you point me in the right direction again…
And another question about another board where you also help folks…this guy keeps posting the FDA approved FT calculator…TRuT ( funny cause in dutch this word is the same or almost the same as cunt) but this calculator doesnt count high SHBG, but the higher youre TT the higher your FT…so that just doesn’t fall in line with everything you can find on high SHBG, whats your thought about this?
and sorry for the hyjack of this topic…

#7

There’s a pretty thorough back and forth in a fairly recent thread on this, do a search.
Transferrine is the number of containers transferring your ferritin around (so to speak), Transferrine Saturation is how full they are. What is your serum Iron? RBC count?
SHBG is a separate marker, low T raises it, high T lowers it. Ill health tends to lower it, Metformin raises it, it’s complicated.

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#8

Thanks for pointing out that test-u is dosed differently. In that case I have no idea how much to use or how long it will be before it effects me. I want this brain fog gone ASAP. So I guess I will use test-e/c. But then there is the issue of me being overseas a few weeks at a time a couple of times a year. This is much more complicated than I initially thought, I need to do some reading before taking any action.

#9

It takes a healthy dose and a lot of patience. Undecanoate is designed to get you to the bottom or middle of the range, but long term. That big shot means a big needle and a big knot of suspension. For middle of the road at best.

#10

I didn’t realise that test-u was designed for middle or bottom of the range. I want top or middle of the range, so I guess it’s test-e/c for me. What should I do when I travel overseas for weeks at a time?

#11

f you can buy it there, good. If you have a script, take it with you. If you can mail some to yourself ahead of time then that works. Or find some Sustanon or Omnadren and that can kind of hold you for two weeks or so.

#12

Australia is the anti-TRT capital of the world, even with a prescription is hand be prepared to go full hypogonadal during your stay.

HCG will keep the testicles producing a little bit of testosterone and estrogen, note anastrozole cannot affect E2 inside the testicles, so HCG dosage would then need to be reduced if the goal is to lower estrogen.

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#13

Sustanon sounds like the real deal

I’m from Australia! So that’s why I have no prescription here.

I haven’t considered anastrozole.arimidex. I was going to use that on a need to basis

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#14

Hello man. Im interested to tell me about your inejctions.

You are saying you use small insulin needles for IM injections EOD? How does that work for you?

Is there pain in these muscles, can you load them at the gym after injection?

I thought eod or ed can be done only with sub q. Also can you tell me the size of these needles in cm, in what units is 27-29?

#15

@low_t_soiboi

As @systemlord stated the TRT BIBLE is great. I got it on audiobook myself. I too suffered from iron deficient anemia and use Ferretts Iron Supplements 106mg elemental iron with 1000mg vit C along with 1000mg L-lysine (all at once) twice a day. I felt better within a few days.

@vonko1988

I just started IM injections using 30g 1/2 inch needle 1mg Easy Touch insulin syringes and shooting in the delts every other day. I don’t feel it 3 secs after the shot. I could have someone shoot it in my delt in the middle of me doing a shoulder press and I wouldn’t feel a thing. So far it works great. Google a measurement calculator if you want CM conversion.

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#16

I used 29 gauge syringes everyday, no pain at all. I’m not sure I would want the attention if someone witnessed me injecting T, I doubt the gym would allow syringes onsite.

#17

I didnt mean injecting at the gym, but whether you can perform reaustqnce trqining after that. I understood now, this is very good news for me because I know many guys cannot handle sub q.

As a sude note in my country it is totally fine to inject at the gym locker and if you cannot make yourself injections almost all guys working at the gym can inject you this is seen as a normal practice :smiley: :smiley: :smiley:

#19

My first full test before I start TRT (let me know if any units are more commonly used that listed below)

Testosterone (Total): 14.7 nmol/L (this is 424ng/dL, last year I was at 565 ng/dL and this is the only metric that was tested)
SHBG: 33 nmol/L
FAI: 44.5 %
Free Testosterone: 301 pmol/L
FSH: 2.1 IU/L
LH: 1.5 IU/L
Oestradiol: <50 pmol/L

Supposed ranged according to the test
Testosterone (Total): None given (isn’t that interesting?)
SHBG: 15 - 50 nmol/L
FAI: 15 - 100 %
Free Testosterone: 260 - 740 pmol/L
FSH: 1 - 12 IU/L
LH: 0.6 - 12 IU/L
Oestradiol: <160 pmol/L

My takeaways from this:
Lower total test, I need TRT to cure my brain fog
Not sure what to make of SHBG/FAI
Free Testosterone proves I’m low
FSH/LH are low, but I’m not sure to what extent
I’m not sure what the Oestradiol means, the range seems vague

Please let me know if I should read into any of this.

#20

Oestradiol is E2. You are definitely low but yea weird no total T. I suspect that would be low too.

We personally do not think TRT is a lifelong commitment and there is nothing wrong with a 6 month trial to see if symptoms are alleviated.

#21

If you have a script it shouldnt be an issue bringing test with you. Guy on here have brought it to Asian countries where they hang you for a joint and not had issues. You could mail it to your hotel ahead of time or something if its ugl.you could put it in an insulin vial. I highly doubt security or customs will risk taking someones insulin because “you forgot the rx at home”

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