T Nation

27 YO Firefighter Starting TRT - in KS


`Hey everyone,

-age 27
-height 5’7"
-waist 30-32"
-weight 155
-describe body and facial hair - not a lot of body hair, j can grow facial hair but not a thick mustache or beard.
-describe where you carry fat and how changed - I haven’t ever carried much fat.
-health conditions, symptoms [history] no health problems
-describe diet - I eat fairly healthy. I do have to diet and cut weight for competition (5-10lbs)
-testes ache, ever, with a fever? No
-how have morning wood and nocturnal erections changed
Better already after one injection. Lost them during propecia treatment for the most part.

Finastride/Dutastride user for around two years. Had severe moderate sides at first on a high dose 1.25mg. I quit and switched to propecia. Mild sides so I lowered the dose until I was down to .25mg eod still with decreased libido and some problems with erections. I eventually wanted my sex life to improve more than I wanted my hair so I dropped the propecia entirely. Didn’t have a big crash or intense rebound, but I have in the past when coming on and off higher doses.

I was an avid powerlifter but I lost a lot of my love for lifting over time. I have a short attention span and attributed my loss of passion for lifting to that. I switched to Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. I am now very involved in BJJ competition and train 4 days a week 2x a day. I lift about 2x a week when I am at work as a fireman.

I have noticed that my interest in sex is fairly low. When I get home from training I just want to go to bed. My girlfriend is the main initiator of sex. If she didn’t bring it up I could just go to bed without thinking about it. One of the worst symptoms is brain fog. I forget things everywhere and an absent minded to the point it effects my work at times. I think all of the symptoms can be traced back to my use of Propecia.

I think I am able to train 2x a day and compete in Jiu Jitsu because I take a lot of caffeine and mainly run on adrenaline. Once I get home I just want to lay around and do nothing, I can’t stand the thought of doing any house projects, lifting weights, wrestling with my son etc. I also feel pretty bad during training. I wake up like an 80 year old, sore joints etc. My buddy mentioned I might be low T and that is when I went to get checked. I was very surprised they were actually low. I figured it was all in my head.

I would love to find a great Doc here in Kansas because Low T Center doesn’t offer HCG or any thing besides on site injections. I would PM KSman but don’t have privileges yet.

I also look forward to hearing any advice as well as sharing my experience.

More Labs: TT was up to 372, I went to Low T Center right after this and they got 277. Strange.


Where in Kansas? Lawrence here.

The 5-alpha reductase inhibitor drugs caused the damage.

Please follow these links in the 2nd post of the 1st topic in this forum:

  • advice for new guys
  • things that damage your hormones
  • protocol for injections
  • finding a TRT doc

You need these labs:
LH/FSH - must be done before TRT
AM cortisol
CBC with hematocrit

TRT: Fertility needs to be preserved. You will need to inject 250iu hCG SC EOD or your testes will whither and you could become sterile.

Please check oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics link.

Your training with your current state, on caffeine and adrenaline may cause damage and increase rT3 that blocks fT3 the thyroid hormone that supports your metabolic rate.

Do you get cold[er] easily now?
Do you use iodized salt or vitamins listing iodine+selenium
Outer eyebrows sparse?


Thanks for replying!

I’m in Shawnee. Fairly close to Lawrence. I called the compounding pharmacy you have mentioned in Lenexa and got a few doctors names. Sadly they are prohibitively expensive or not taking new patients. I have about three online HRT health clinics I have spoken with, just waiting to send my labs when I receive them from labcorp/privatemdlabs.

I had my first injection on saturday at the Low T Center. I wish I had waited now because I’m scrambling to find hCG to preserve my testes. I should have labs(Done before any test injections) by the end of the week and hopefully get the hCG going shortly after. How much danger am I in doing an injection next week before I get hCG?

I keep my house very cold, but like the cold and wouldn’t say I get cold more than anyone else. I use regular salt, I don’t think its iodized. My outer eyebrows are definitely lighter in color but I wouldn’t say they’re sparse.

Current Temp is 96.5 (Wow, low) I will check again upon waking.

I will continue to read the stickys. Thank you!


T testosterone mills are not really focused on your well-being.
Did you contact Rock Creek Wellness? They are not cheap, but its all about your quality of life.


Rock Creek seemed outrageous price wise. I had a physical at ProPartnersMD today. He wants to see when my labs come in. They prescribe everything protocol wise but I didn’t ask him exactly what my protocol would be. It’s much cheaper. Hoping this works out, many of the Online offices have at least taken time explain things and listen to what I have going on.


I was unable to check AM temp. We were woken up really early on a call at work. Still have low temp today 96.5 ish. Ordering Iodoral supplement today.


Labs added from Low T Center. Still waiting on Full hormone panel.


Morning temp was 96.5 upon waking today. 96.1 at 12:45.


Please follow these links in the 2nd post of the 1st topic in this forum:

  • advice for new guys
  • things that damage your hormones
  • protocol for injections
  • finding a TRT doc
    - thyroid basics explained

Getting thyroid care can be very difficult as the lab ranges tell doctors that you are “normal”. Ask ProPartners if they will help you with this issue. Your fT3 will tell us a lot. If it is mid-range or higher, we can conclude that rT3 is elevated and blocking fT3 and that stress and adrenal fatigue are factors.


Thank you! I am glad I could get the LH and FSH levels. Do these tell me if I’m primary or secondary? Does it matter at this point?


FSH is low and FSH and LH are often similar numbers. FSH has a longer half life. LH has a short half life and released in pulses. LH labs are a snap shot of a moving target. For non-TRT guys, FSH is a better indicator of LH status than LH itself.

So you are secondary. But why? That is why we need more labs. Sometimes thyroid problems contribute to this. Your prolactin is low, and is not a cause.

The pituitary can be damaged by a blow to the head or whiplash. Pituitary adinomas can be the cause; but in this case it could not a prolactin secreting adinoma.

Your SHBG is rather high relative to your E2. While higher E2 can increase SHBG, low T levels tend to in crease SHBG.

When will the additional lab results be available?


Just added some new lab work from last Saturday. Any input would be appreciated. Thanks.


Not obvious where.
Changed first post and in first image?

prolactin is not a factor

LH/FSH low

AST/ALT good, no obvious issues with liver

Total cholesterol 135 is a big problem for hormones. Cascade of steroid hormones starts with cholesterol. Cholesterol <160 is associated with increased all cause mortality. We see this often enough here with younger males. Reasons unknown. Diet changes may help, but most cholesterol is made in the liver and diet is not the main contributor. Some have taken Rx cholesterol.

Testosterone is low and HTC, RBC, total proteins and E2 are typical for this. FT in in line with what we expect with low T.

But SHBG is at an unexplained high level relative to TT, FT and E2.

Calcium is oddly high normal.

TSH=1.91 is not near 1.0 and T2 is below midrange.
Higher T3 uptake values can indicate that T3 is lower.
We really needed fT3 and fT4 AND rT3.

IGF-1 is a but low for your age group. Might be influenced by low T and thyroid issues.

BUN is high. With higher SHBG pointing to the liver, and BUN possibly also, warrants some further consideration of liver function. Low cholesterol is another liver connection. Doctors are looking for diseases and will probably not be concerned with any of this and most will thing that low cholesterol is a great thing.

Again, iodine is a major concern and added iodine must be accompanied by selenium.

You have secondary hypogonadism and cause may be Finasteride/Dutasteride.

You can try a HPTA Restart - see links. If that fails, go to TRT.

BUN can be elevated by taking a lot of things like naproxen.

While low T is clearly from low LH/FSH, I suspect that low cholesterol has created lower DHEA and pregnenolone. Progesterone and cortisol can then also be low. Low DHEA can limit DHEA–>testosterone. You can try DHEA 25mg. But you should complete my list of labs to get these things sorted out.

Your intense training, overcoming the above problems with adrenalin is really inviting adrenal fatigue. Your adrenals may collapse. rT3 lab is needed to see whats going on. Behavior modification is needed. While you do need more iodine, I strongly suspect that this will not be everything that is needed.

So that is a lot of stuff to deal with. You can’t do this on your own and need a good medical partner.
Overcoming the suspected rT3 issue may require dosing with T3, suppressing TSH, lowering T4 which then lowers T4–>rT3.


Starvation diets can increase rT3, slowing you down to survive the famine. And this can cause permanent epigenetic changes, that can span generations by altering gene expression [DNA does not change].

If you have been eating a low fat diet, that needs to stop.


Ive never been on a low fat diet. ill go with a sub 1600 cal diet for at most a week at a time to make weight. I cut carbs before protein or fat and always keep fat above 50g with olive oil, fish oil, avocados, natty pb.

Creatinine/bun has been high since I started working three years ago. It’s been on my annual blood test every time. Can’t this be explained by having been on a high protein diet 160-200g a day for the last 6 years?

Started Iodine 50mg a day yesterday. Will report temps in a few days.


The bottom of my first post has the new labs.


2013 blood work


1/28/15 blood work. Sorry, I wish they had tested much more.


Not much more to add. Cholesterol is a major problem. Meanwhile, DHEA is one thing that you can do.


Started Dhea a couple days ago as well. Will report back.

I’m actually at a work physical now. New blood work shows cholesterol at 133 on a scale of 125-200. How does that cause major problems as opposed to being say 40 or 50 points higher?