25th anniversary of Reagan's Iran-Contra Scandal

[DoubleDuce]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
Soo… the “EPA” killed the steel industry?[/quote]

No , Ronald Reagan killed the steel industry, I personally would not want to live in a Country that had no environmental regulations [/quote]

But you just said that those regulations are at least part of what made the industry not competitive.[/quote]

You have to think out side the box , it is not the problem it is the solution . Steel is a (VERY) DIRTY industry. It not only pollutes the local environment it has far reaching effects . If we have to compete with people that have no inclination to protect the environment than we should penalize them with a tariff.[/quote]

So should domestic companies be penalized for not having the same transportation costs?[/quote]

I can tell you first hand America has many costs associated with transportation that third world countries do not . I doubt that loading steel on a rickety old boat and dumping it in some port is all that expensive
[/quote]

well, one, you are wrong, it can be quite expensive. two, as I noted before, there are lots of other disadvantages to it. And three, the people shipping from overseas still have to deal with the same transportation costs inside the US.

[pittbulll]

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
Soo… the “EPA” killed the steel industry?[/quote]

No , Ronald Reagan killed the steel industry, I personally would not want to live in a Country that had no environmental regulations [/quote]

But you just said that those regulations are at least part of what made the industry not competitive.[/quote]

You have to think out side the box , it is not the problem it is the solution . Steel is a (VERY) DIRTY industry. It not only pollutes the local environment it has far reaching effects . If we have to compete with people that have no inclination to protect the environment than we should penalize them with a tariff.[/quote]

So should domestic companies be penalized for not having the same transportation costs?[/quote]

I can tell you first hand America has many costs associated with transportation that third world countries do not . I doubt that loading steel on a rickety old boat and dumping it in some port is all that expensive
[/quote]

well, one, you are wrong, it can be quite expensive. two, as I noted before, there are lots of other disadvantages to it. And three, the people shipping from overseas still have to deal with the same transportation costs inside the US.[/quote]

A third world country loads it on an uninsured boat , pays any help it does have poor wages .
it is not until they get to America until they start to spend real money . America has Regulations pertaining to insurance , health and saftey , environmental , wages, working conditions , living conditions and the list goes on

I am sorry you are wrong

[pittbulll]

we won’t even get into taxes

[pittbulll]

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]BlueCollarTr8n wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
Soo… the “EPA” killed the steel industry?[/quote]

No , Ronald Reagan killed the steel industry, I personally would not want to live in a Country that had no environmental regulations [/quote]

But you just said that those regulations are at least part of what made the industry not competitive.[/quote]

You have to think out side the box , it is not the problem it is the solution . Steel is a (VERY) DIRTY industry. It not only pollutes the local environment it has far reaching effects . If we have to compete with people that have no inclination to protect the environment than we should penalize them with a tariff.[/quote]

I can’t go along with a tariff for envirionmental reasons, just can’t get there. There does have to be some method for dealing with products from industries that receive subsidies. [/quote]

Tariffs are nothing but a way to level playing fields ,exploiting cheaper labor is not good for America , exploiting our environment is not either
[/quote]

lol. So, we should probably raise the taxes on all the competitors of goodwill because they use a less productive labor force. And raise taxes on southern car manufactures. Hell, why not just level it all and have the government make everyone the same?

Raise taxes on ford because they have the unfair advantage of better management.

Differences in the “playing field” are what make all business succeed or fail. To level the field would be to make it where no business failed. Then we could all be poor and destitute together.
[/quote]

I am sorry this is nonsenses

[DoubleDuce]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
Soo… the “EPA” killed the steel industry?[/quote]

No , Ronald Reagan killed the steel industry, I personally would not want to live in a Country that had no environmental regulations [/quote]

But you just said that those regulations are at least part of what made the industry not competitive.[/quote]

You have to think out side the box , it is not the problem it is the solution . Steel is a (VERY) DIRTY industry. It not only pollutes the local environment it has far reaching effects . If we have to compete with people that have no inclination to protect the environment than we should penalize them with a tariff.[/quote]

So should domestic companies be penalized for not having the same transportation costs?[/quote]

I can tell you first hand America has many costs associated with transportation that third world countries do not . I doubt that loading steel on a rickety old boat and dumping it in some port is all that expensive
[/quote]

well, one, you are wrong, it can be quite expensive. two, as I noted before, there are lots of other disadvantages to it. And three, the people shipping from overseas still have to deal with the same transportation costs inside the US.[/quote]

A third world country loads it on an uninsured boat , pays any help it does have poor wages .
it is not until they get to America until they start to spend real money . America has Regulations pertaining to insurance , health and saftey , environmental , wages, working conditions , living conditions and the list goes on

I am sorry you are wrong[/quote]

I deal extensively with purchasing and engineering across continents…

[DoubleDuce]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]BlueCollarTr8n wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
Soo… the “EPA” killed the steel industry?[/quote]

No , Ronald Reagan killed the steel industry, I personally would not want to live in a Country that had no environmental regulations [/quote]

But you just said that those regulations are at least part of what made the industry not competitive.[/quote]

You have to think out side the box , it is not the problem it is the solution . Steel is a (VERY) DIRTY industry. It not only pollutes the local environment it has far reaching effects . If we have to compete with people that have no inclination to protect the environment than we should penalize them with a tariff.[/quote]

I can’t go along with a tariff for envirionmental reasons, just can’t get there. There does have to be some method for dealing with products from industries that receive subsidies. [/quote]

Tariffs are nothing but a way to level playing fields ,exploiting cheaper labor is not good for America , exploiting our environment is not either
[/quote]

lol. So, we should probably raise the taxes on all the competitors of goodwill because they use a less productive labor force. And raise taxes on southern car manufactures. Hell, why not just level it all and have the government make everyone the same?

Raise taxes on ford because they have the unfair advantage of better management.

Differences in the “playing field” are what make all business succeed or fail. To level the field would be to make it where no business failed. Then we could all be poor and destitute together.
[/quote]

I am sorry this is nonsenses [/quote]

No, it isn’t. Who gets to decide what an unfair advantage, in need of leveling, is?

[pittbulll]

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
Soo… the “EPA” killed the steel industry?[/quote]

No , Ronald Reagan killed the steel industry, I personally would not want to live in a Country that had no environmental regulations [/quote]

But you just said that those regulations are at least part of what made the industry not competitive.[/quote]

You have to think out side the box , it is not the problem it is the solution . Steel is a (VERY) DIRTY industry. It not only pollutes the local environment it has far reaching effects . If we have to compete with people that have no inclination to protect the environment than we should penalize them with a tariff.[/quote]

So should domestic companies be penalized for not having the same transportation costs?[/quote]

I can tell you first hand America has many costs associated with transportation that third world countries do not . I doubt that loading steel on a rickety old boat and dumping it in some port is all that expensive
[/quote]

well, one, you are wrong, it can be quite expensive. two, as I noted before, there are lots of other disadvantages to it. And three, the people shipping from overseas still have to deal with the same transportation costs inside the US.[/quote]

A third world country loads it on an uninsured boat , pays any help it does have poor wages .
it is not until they get to America until they start to spend real money . America has Regulations pertaining to insurance , health and saftey , environmental , wages, working conditions , living conditions and the list goes on

I am sorry you are wrong[/quote]

I deal extensively with purchasing and engineering across continents…[/quote]

I deal extensivly with transportation, physically and financially

[DoubleDuce]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
Soo… the “EPA” killed the steel industry?[/quote]

No , Ronald Reagan killed the steel industry, I personally would not want to live in a Country that had no environmental regulations [/quote]

But you just said that those regulations are at least part of what made the industry not competitive.[/quote]

You have to think out side the box , it is not the problem it is the solution . Steel is a (VERY) DIRTY industry. It not only pollutes the local environment it has far reaching effects . If we have to compete with people that have no inclination to protect the environment than we should penalize them with a tariff.[/quote]

So should domestic companies be penalized for not having the same transportation costs?[/quote]

I can tell you first hand America has many costs associated with transportation that third world countries do not . I doubt that loading steel on a rickety old boat and dumping it in some port is all that expensive
[/quote]

well, one, you are wrong, it can be quite expensive. two, as I noted before, there are lots of other disadvantages to it. And three, the people shipping from overseas still have to deal with the same transportation costs inside the US.[/quote]

A third world country loads it on an uninsured boat , pays any help it does have poor wages .
it is not until they get to America until they start to spend real money . America has Regulations pertaining to insurance , health and saftey , environmental , wages, working conditions , living conditions and the list goes on

I am sorry you are wrong[/quote]

I deal extensively with purchasing and engineering across continents…[/quote]

I deal extensivly with transportation, physically and financially [/quote]

You ever taken a product from concept to production overseas for the American market?

[pittbulll]

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
Soo… the “EPA” killed the steel industry?[/quote]

No , Ronald Reagan killed the steel industry, I personally would not want to live in a Country that had no environmental regulations [/quote]

But you just said that those regulations are at least part of what made the industry not competitive.[/quote]

You have to think out side the box , it is not the problem it is the solution . Steel is a (VERY) DIRTY industry. It not only pollutes the local environment it has far reaching effects . If we have to compete with people that have no inclination to protect the environment than we should penalize them with a tariff.[/quote]

So should domestic companies be penalized for not having the same transportation costs?[/quote]

I can tell you first hand America has many costs associated with transportation that third world countries do not . I doubt that loading steel on a rickety old boat and dumping it in some port is all that expensive
[/quote]

well, one, you are wrong, it can be quite expensive. two, as I noted before, there are lots of other disadvantages to it. And three, the people shipping from overseas still have to deal with the same transportation costs inside the US.[/quote]

A third world country loads it on an uninsured boat , pays any help it does have poor wages .
it is not until they get to America until they start to spend real money . America has Regulations pertaining to insurance , health and saftey , environmental , wages, working conditions , living conditions and the list goes on

I am sorry you are wrong[/quote]

I deal extensively with purchasing and engineering across continents…[/quote]

I deal extensivly with transportation, physically and financially [/quote]

You ever taken a product from concept to production overseas for the American market?[/quote]

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading

[DoubleDuce]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.

[pittbulll]

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs

[DoubleDuce]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs
[/quote]

We don’t compete with any Vietnamese manufacturers of cranes. The same things you are talking about are also what prevent them from producing things.

It’s places like Japan and Germany we compete with. So, tell me again, how much cheaper is it?

[pittbulll]

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs
[/quote]

We don’t compete with any Vietnamese manufacturers of cranes. The same things you are talking about are also what prevent them from producing things.

It’s places like Japan and Germany we compete with. So, tell me again, how much cheaper is it?[/quote]

If they had the technology they would not be 3rd world , I don’t understand your question

[DoubleDuce]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs
[/quote]

We don’t compete with any Vietnamese manufacturers of cranes. The same things you are talking about are also what prevent them from producing things.

It’s places like Japan and Germany we compete with. So, tell me again, how much cheaper is it?[/quote]

If they had the technology they would not be 3rd world , I don’t understand your question
[/quote]

I’m saying that japan and Germany have regulations and still import here. That’s who I compete with.

[pittbulll]

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs
[/quote]

We don’t compete with any Vietnamese manufacturers of cranes. The same things you are talking about are also what prevent them from producing things.

It’s places like Japan and Germany we compete with. So, tell me again, how much cheaper is it?[/quote]

I am curious how you leap from 3rd world countries and then Japan and expect the conversation to flow uninterupted, we were talking steel

[orion]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs
[/quote]

We don’t compete with any Vietnamese manufacturers of cranes. The same things you are talking about are also what prevent them from producing things.

It’s places like Japan and Germany we compete with. So, tell me again, how much cheaper is it?[/quote]

I am curious how you leap from 3rd world countries and then Japan and expect the conversation to flow uninterupted, we were talking steel [/quote]

Oh, this is where you compete with us.

Our former nationalized industry that is, which after much wailing and gnashing of teeth got privatized and is now employing more people than it ever did after having laid off one third of the work force initially.

But then, we have a 25% corporate flat tax and you can deduct expenses like you would not believe.

[DoubleDuce]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs
[/quote]

We don’t compete with any Vietnamese manufacturers of cranes. The same things you are talking about are also what prevent them from producing things.

It’s places like Japan and Germany we compete with. So, tell me again, how much cheaper is it?[/quote]

I am curious how you leap from 3rd world countries and then Japan and expect the conversation to flow uninterupted, we were talking steel [/quote]

Most of what we have been talking about has been more general terms.

But my point in this is that the infrastructure that leads to expensiveness also has advantages.

We buy large steel weldments from Mexico. There is a large tradeoff between initial cost and quality/reliability.

But more generally:
Not having insurance mean that the supplier is screwed if something messes up, and buying from them, you assume part of that risk. If the exporting countries inspections are poor, it more likely there is something wrong with the shipment when they get here. If you pay someone barely enough to eat on and have them working 12 hour days without breaks, work quality suffers, workers become unreliable, est. If you are buying from a country with unstable politics, you can lose your supply if something happens there (this has happened to us).

[pittbulll]

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs
[/quote]

We don’t compete with any Vietnamese manufacturers of cranes. The same things you are talking about are also what prevent them from producing things.

It’s places like Japan and Germany we compete with. So, tell me again, how much cheaper is it?[/quote]

I am curious how you leap from 3rd world countries and then Japan and expect the conversation to flow uninterupted, we were talking steel [/quote]

Most of what we have been talking about has been more general terms.

But my point in this is that the infrastructure that leads to expensiveness also has advantages.

We buy large steel weldments from Mexico. There is a large tradeoff between initial cost and quality/reliability.

But more generally:
Not having insurance mean that the supplier is screwed if something messes up, and buying from them, you assume part of that risk. If the exporting countries inspections are poor, it more likely there is something wrong with the shipment when they get here. If you pay someone barely enough to eat on and have them working 12 hour days without breaks, work quality suffers, workers become unreliable, est. If you are buying from a country with unstable politics, you can lose your supply if something happens there (this has happened to us).
[/quote]

I believe you , it almost sounds like you are making my argument

[DoubleDuce]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs
[/quote]

We don’t compete with any Vietnamese manufacturers of cranes. The same things you are talking about are also what prevent them from producing things.

It’s places like Japan and Germany we compete with. So, tell me again, how much cheaper is it?[/quote]

I am curious how you leap from 3rd world countries and then Japan and expect the conversation to flow uninterupted, we were talking steel [/quote]

Most of what we have been talking about has been more general terms.

But my point in this is that the infrastructure that leads to expensiveness also has advantages.

We buy large steel weldments from Mexico. There is a large tradeoff between initial cost and quality/reliability.

But more generally:
Not having insurance mean that the supplier is screwed if something messes up, and buying from them, you assume part of that risk. If the exporting countries inspections are poor, it more likely there is something wrong with the shipment when they get here. If you pay someone barely enough to eat on and have them working 12 hour days without breaks, work quality suffers, workers become unreliable, est. If you are buying from a country with unstable politics, you can lose your supply if something happens there (this has happened to us).
[/quote]

I believe you , it almost sounds like you are making my argument[/quote]

No, I’m saying living in a developed country is a big benefit to manufacturing. That developed countries have an “unfair” advantage.

[pittbulll]

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

NO but I have a step son that has,(Shit you may be him:) when was the last time you were in a port or saw a bill of lading
[/quote]

Not in a while. Ship a 200,000 pound crane across an ocean and tell me it’s cheap.

But again, as I’ve stated, that’s only one part of what makes it a disadvantage.[/quote]

You live in America , try going to VietNam , no insurance , probably no port fee , hell no tax,no minimum wage , getting it to port would be a lot simpler as well , no truck insurance , no business license no tax ,probably no drivers license No environmental stardards to comply with . You want to compare apple trees and seeds

I doubt you are fortunate enough to conduct business with out paying tariffs
[/quote]

We don’t compete with any Vietnamese manufacturers of cranes. The same things you are talking about are also what prevent them from producing things.

It’s places like Japan and Germany we compete with. So, tell me again, how much cheaper is it?[/quote]

I am curious how you leap from 3rd world countries and then Japan and expect the conversation to flow uninterupted, we were talking steel [/quote]

Most of what we have been talking about has been more general terms.

But my point in this is that the infrastructure that leads to expensiveness also has advantages.

We buy large steel weldments from Mexico. There is a large tradeoff between initial cost and quality/reliability.

But more generally:
Not having insurance mean that the supplier is screwed if something messes up, and buying from them, you assume part of that risk. If the exporting countries inspections are poor, it more likely there is something wrong with the shipment when they get here. If you pay someone barely enough to eat on and have them working 12 hour days without breaks, work quality suffers, workers become unreliable, est. If you are buying from a country with unstable politics, you can lose your supply if something happens there (this has happened to us).
[/quote]

I believe you , it almost sounds like you are making my argument[/quote]

No, I’m saying living in a developed country is a big benefit to manufacturing. That developed countries have an “unfair” advantage.[/quote]

Not when it come to price , not all steel in used for equipment , some is used for as simple as rebar