[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
Beowolf wrote:
Then stop saying we are the ultimate moralists.
And this needs to be addressed.
Far too often, when Westerners criticize Islamic societies for doing whatever they do, there is a response that “well, America isn’t perfect either, you know - you should recognize that”.
It is a frequent non-starter. We don’t have to think America is perfect to think that the Islamists are morally unjustified in what they do.
I think the US has tons of work to do in improving its foreign policy - that is mutually exclusive from the fact that I think US foreign policy is not to blame for Islamism.
Again, one does not have to believe America to be perfect to think that America didn’t cause the barbarians of the ME to become enemies of civlization.[/quote]
The problem is, when a presidential candidate says 9/11 had absolutely no reasoning behind it, whether it was right or wrong, causes us to stop trying to fix the problem.
By not admitting that the US’s actions are the base cause of their hatred (of the majority) we do not move to change it.
US foreign policy is certainly not to blame for Islams expansionist semi-crazy attitudes of today. But it is certainly to blame for the way they hate US. They don’t hate us for our freedoms, or because we let our women walk around uncovered. They hate us because we have continually interfered, whether that interference was just or not, in their affairs.
When we point out the US isn’t perfect, we are trying to say this:
We can change the masses opinions of us in the Middle East. We may never change the total crazies, but because of our actions in Iraq, a new generation of otherwise PERFECTLY normal and peaceful Muslims will grow up being convinced to hate us, and that ultimate glory will come from killing us.
That is the point of Lixy’s posts. Though it is not always clear, he, along with the rest of us “America is not perfect”-ers, are trying to say we have options here. We CAN change things. They’re not spontaneously convincing the masses to hate America, it’s founded somewhere.
If there was no foundation, terrorist recruitment would drop off. How could they convince somebody to go kill themselves to kill a bunch of Americans if they’ve never cared about America or heard much about it in the first place?
Get my point?