T Nation

20Y/O. Planning First Cycle


#1

Hi all, I have been lifting weights for 6 years, training seriously, accounting for macronutrients, and focusing on supplementation for 4. I obtained my sports nutritional certification through ACSM - I’ve committed a significant portion of my life towards pursuits of bodybuilding, in addition to acting and modeling. I also have an extensive athletic background throughout highschool and on into college: Several years of varsity football, private boxing lessons, powerlifting meets, and mixed-martial arts training.

I realize there tends to be something of a stigma surrounding use of steroids at this age, even within the bodybuilding community. The bottom-line is - I intend on starting my first “actual” cycle shortly after my 21st birthday, which is in October. My parents are trying to support me through this process and are helping me pursue legal means of running multiple steroids cycles, with the end goal of my accomplishing it in as safe and effective of a manner as possible. Currently I’m engaged in dialogue with a couple of different clinics in both Florida and California that are willing to work with me and interpret my bloodwork and hormone levels as necessary to warrant prescribing me medication.

In the film industry, appearance is highly competitive, and using PED’s is both commonplace and widely ignored. That being said, many of the roles that I audition for, I find myself competing with those who have attained a tier of aesthetic and/or density that simply cannot be accomplished without practices of hormone optimization and use of AAS. For the benefit of my career, this is the direction that I have determined I wish to go.

Sorry for the excessive elaboration on myself, I’m not trying to appear arrogant or a know-it-all, I would just prefer to make my purpose and motivations known. With regards to steroids there is still so much I need to learn, but I tear apart every piece of literature on the matter that I can find, and will continue to do so, but the experiences and opinions of others in this case seem equally if not more valuable than many other sources.

My current stats are:

6’, 207.5lbs, 11-12% bodyfat.
Deadlift: 565
Squat: 405
Bench: 365

Before this actual cycle, while I am still 20, I plan on running -
Weeks 1-10: Testosterone Enanthate 500mg (2x250mg)
PCT Weeks 12-15: Nolvadrex 40/40/20/20

After getting full bloodwork and sufficient time to adjust… Here is the first “real” cycle that I’ve put together to follow it up.

15 weeks total.

Weeks 1-15 Testosterone Propionate 50mg 2x a week. (Thinking of subbing for Test Cyp. at 400mg per week)

Weeks 6-15 Anavar (Oxandrolone) 25mg of tabs per day

Weeks 3-10 Deca-Durabolin 75mg 2x a week.
Nolvadex 20mg per day.

W16: Nolvadex 40mg per day
W17-18: Nolvadex 20mg per day

Let me know what you guys think.
-Kai


#2

Wait for another 10 years otherwise you will greatly regret it later in life.

I know its not want you want to hear but as soon as you start playing around with your hormones you permanently screw up your bodies natural balance.

At 21 your body is raging with natural hormones , replacing these with synthetics wont give you much more benefit from what you already have unless you seriously up the dosages and then you’re really asking for trouble.

With good training and nutrition and patience you can achieve the same results. You just wont be able to party hard every weekend if you are training properly.


#3

So I just have to play devil’s advocate and say throw some pics up mandatory poses. Because with out proof re read this.

Then I believe those are pretty well thought out cycles, for some who have cycled before.

With that out the way don’t do any thing that has a long water like deca only because of your trying to get a trt/hrt script it will mess with results.

Also I would say your getting Damn close to genetic potential. Arnold was maxed out at 235 and 6’2 or 3 if you ask him.

Also post some diet and training nutrition you use.


#4

At 20 his body is still developing - who knows what his genetic potential could be?

Once you go over to the dark side you can never go back. lol


#5

Come to the dark side @kai.c.k hahahaha in a Darth Sidious voice


#6

@geofit I can certainly appreciate the merits of waiting. Unfortunately the problem I’m running into is that almost everyone involved in fitness modeling, and many of the guys competing for the acting roles I audition for, are a step ahead of me, because despite being around my age, they’ve already crossed that line. An example is an audition I had for a role as a Gladiator in an upcoming Showtime series, I was in a pool of guys auditioning who were between 18 and 25, and out of 20 or so guys there, at least 1/3 were definitively running gear. I made it to call-backs, but of that smaller group of 6 guys, I was by far the smallest and least vascular. I am not the type of person that thinks that anyone bigger than me is on steroids, but I’m also well aware that an average male between 5’10 and 6’ is not capable of attaining a 230+ lb physique at 6-8% bodyfat.

The bottom line of that long-winded statement is: I don’t know what the best approach is for me with regards to an exact cycle, but I know that despite my age, I need to find some kind of edge that allows me to compete with the others in my industry that are using.

Also, this is probably a good time to clarify. I smoke weed once every week or two weeks on average, and I don’t drink at college - Only when I’m visiting family on breaks or holidays. Early in highschool I abused a lot of hard drugs, smoked weed every day, and drank heavily on a regular basis. When I was 17, I had a friend die of an overdose and I dropped everything. Only recently have I reincorporated marijuana into my life as an occasional release. Realistically, working out compulsively is my only vice.

@norse_str3ngth I will post some recent pics soon
The best I have as of right now is a picture from this last summer, at the time these photos were taken I weighed 221lbs.

Front
Back

EDIT: Fixed Link

My current diet is 45% protein, 30% fat, and 25% carbohydrates. I’m currently eating 2876 calories a day, with the intention of losing a quarter pound of fat per week. At this point I’m just trying to maintain current strength and get down to single digit bodyfat. I’ve already noticed significant diminishment in energy levels and strength, but my training program has shifted towards higher volume and more moderate weight. When I’m on a calorie surplus I go much heavier.

I’m currently taking Lysine, Theanine, Arginine, Ornithine, GABA, and Fish oils. In powders I use 5 grams of glutamine in the morning on an empty stomach, and 5 grams in the evening before bed. Creatine I take 10 grams an hour before working out with a scoop of protein and consume another 10 grams immediately after. Glycine I take 2 grams per day. I also use a 2:1:1 BCAA complex with Leucine, Isoleucine, and Valine.

In terms of nutrition, breakfast usually consists of 8 egg whites with 2 strips of turkey bacon, and 2 packets of oatmeal or probiotic greek yogurt. I usually have 4 scoops of protein every day at various points between meals and during classes in order to maintain my desired ratio and fill in additional calories. Lunch consists of a 6-8 chicken breast with mixed vegetables and brown jasmine rice. My late afternoon/preworkout meal consists of either rice, yogurt, oatmeal, or ezekiel bread. My post workout meal is usually ground beef or steak with brown rice and vegetables. Usually after 9 I only consume protein and avoid carbs, but if I do consume them, I make sure they are complex.

Training - I change my program every 8 weeks, right now my current routine consists of this. I change my rep range on a weekly basis as well as the length of time for the positive and negative of any given (non-compound) movement. I have one large compound movement for major muscle groups, paired with a number of isolation exercises to accompany. An example of a first week would consist of a 10-12 rep range on all compound movements - (2nd Week would be 8-10, 3rd Week 6-8, 4th Week 3-5 - at which point it would reset)

The isolation exercises are another story, I play with the rep range and the weight, but the main focus is on the pace of the rep.

Week 1 I use a 5 second positive and 5 second negative on each rep, Week 2: 10 seconds, Week 3: 15 seconds, Week 4: 5 seconds again, etc…

The compound lift for each day is in parenthesese.

Monday - Back and triceps. (Rackpulls or bent over barbell rows. ) Muay Thai class in evening.
Tuesday - Quads, abs. (Squats)
Wednesday - Cardio/Muay Thai classes in evening
Thursday - Chest and Biceps (Barbell or Dumbbell Bench)
Friday - Hamstrings, abs. (Deadlifts)
Saturday - Shoulders. (Dumbbell or barbell shoulder presses)
Sunday - Forearms, Calves, Abs, and cardio.

Haha, I’ve wanted to join the dark side since I was 15, I just knew it wasn’t the time and that I could and should accomplish more naturally before going over.


#7

Looking good there mate - you’ve made some solid gains for your age keep it up.

I really sympathise with your situation - going into the modelling/acting industry is tough for kids these days.

I guess rejection at castings is just part of the game. There is always gonna be a guy who is taller or shorter, leaner or fatter, lighter or darker. My point is, at castings they are looking for something specific, you just gotta keep trying until that person they are looking for is you.

If you do decide to take gear, you gotta forget about abs at this point and eat a lot more calories, otherwise you’re just gonna be spinning your wheels.


#8

you seem well educated and know what you are doing so i will assist.

keep training the same and diet strict, with your current cycle you will make good gains however i would go for 12 weeks 500mg total per week, 10 is too short for test-e, test e starts peaking around week 8 thats when you really start to feel it, after 12+ weeks to 14 weeks the gains subside and you will have to increase dosage.


#9

Totally agree with @cryptonite keep us on the loop. Definitely jealous of your physique lol.


#10

Im a noob so this is not an advice but why dont you run HCG during cycle? Also I see many people do both clomid+nolva, why you only run Nolva?


#11

@cryptonite

I appreciate the help, I’ll adjust it to 12 weeks then, definitely.

@zarioh

Honestly I just wasn’t sure if it would be necessary, I have a friend that recommended the same. The reason I was hesitant to add it is that Anavar doesn’t aromatize or shut down natural test production. That being said, it might be wise to include as a precaution for the Deca, but I can’t speak to that with any amount of significant knowledge.

Does anyone else have any input on the inclusion of HCG for a cycle like this?


#12

Because 2 serms are overkill.


#13

The HCG is just to speed up the process.


#14

running nolva + clomid = very hard recovery, clomid has an effect of making u feel like shit, also nolva works good enough, some say clomid is more powerful but the sides are worse than nolva.

HCG is commonly ran after last pin then PCT because hcg shuts you down, people run it around 500iu i belive


#15

Does anyone have any input on the inclusion of Deca in the cycle? Open to alternative suggestions, the research I’ve done thus far just led me to believe it would be one of the safer options that would work synergistically with Anavar.


#16

Why run deca, I mean you could. But I wouldn’t, down the line yes. I would probably run NPP first though to see how you respond to it.

Also maybe look at dbol pre workout, instead of the anavar I would probably run proviron


#17

Hey all, just an update. I’m starting the first cycle of Test E as soon as my shipment gets in, near the end of the month.

As of right now I’m getting

12 weeks of Test E at 500mg (2 x 250) per week.
PCT Week 14-16: Nolva 40/40/20/20

And I’m adding in HCG - thinking 275 IU 3x/week for weeks 9-12.

Does anyone have any thoughts on adjustments I should make or more precautionary items I should obtain before proceeding? I’m considering picking up Letrozole in case of gyno onset, but I’m thinking that seems like overkill and I’m not sure what dose I would need to run for it.


#18

Looks good man.


#19

Truthfully you will not know if you need letro unless you are very gyno prone, i would say pass on the letro for now, it is very expensive atleast where i am located and can damage your gains and put your cycle to a halt if you decide to take it.

Letro should only be used while you develop gyno which you will know immediately because it will feel like a soft mass under your nipple the size of a pea, letro tapering protocol will kill it off in a couple weeks but some gyno stays forever even after use even though very miniscule. It all depends on your body and how gyno prone you are. The best way to avoid gyno is to be low BF% that is why many people stress this as much as possible.