T Nation

2 Weeks on Test E and Gel, Lethargic/Tired. What is Going On?


#1

Well things are all over the place for sure, but to make things short:

Had T levels of 5-9nmol over like a years time, fought doctors and met different ones before I FINALLY got put on “testogel” 50mg a day.

Along with natural T levels of 5nmol, I had
LH: 6-7
FSH: 2
SHBG: 20-25
Cortisol slightly above range
Prolactin slightly above range

2 months ago I got on “testogel”, I also went on “finasteride” to fight my hair loss.

A couple weeks into that threatment I showed:

testosterone: 17nmol
SHBG: 13 (huge drop!)
prolactin: still slightly above range

felt “ok” but not much more than that, I can get erections now, but still got energy problems.

So I decided to add my own testosterone injections 125mg testosterone E every 5th day, along with the gel.

I started the 8th of june, so soon 2 weeks. For the last week Ive felt very tired, lethargic. Libido is OK, morning wood every morning, erection quality … “decent”. But so so tired and lethargic, dont wanna do anything.

Can anyone figure out what is going on here?


#2

Can you provide units with range?. A lot of men have issues with finasteride. A quick search of the forums and you can read all about it.

Do you have e2 - estradiol male sensitive array labs? Any thyroid labs?

I would guess your issues are with your e2 or thyroid.


#3

Hi. I dropped finasteride 5 days ago cause I come to understand its just not worth the potential side effects.

Ranges:

Testosterone: 8.6-30
SHBG: 10-80
LH: 1.0-10
FSH: 1.0-10

Prolactin and cortisol ranges I dont remember but I was slightly above range.

My e2 before TRT showed to be below the range, so much it wasnt even “detected”, on TRT I havent got my e2 levels yet.

Thyroid was TSH: 2.0
ft3 upper range, ft4 same


#4

very caution with finasteride!!! make some research about it, many people have regretted for using it


#5

thanks yea i dropped it a few days ago


#6

Bad idea to split your case between here and Jan 17th. Need context of what has been discussed before without going on an Easter egg hunt.

You never posted your oral body temperatures as requested.

Don’t be lazy. Need thyroid numbers, not “upper range”.

Labs numbers and ranges on same lines.

WTF: “Prolactin and cortisol ranges I dont remember but I was slightly above range.”

Your problem may be a combination of low thyroid function [need body temps], possible adrenal fatigue and elevated E2

You do not seem to have the info afforded by reading the stickies.

Evaluate your overall thyroid function by checking oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky. Thyroid hormone fT3 is what gets the job done and it regulates mitochondrial activity, the source of ATP which is the universal currency of cellular energy. This is part of the body’s temperature control loop. This can get messed up if you are iodine deficient. In many countries, you need to be using iodized salt. Other countries add iodine to dairy or bread.


#7

Gels are not ideal as they are not absorbed well if you have any thyroid issues. Also they seem to more T->E2 conversion. I see you have stopped finasteride so I will not make any comment there.

If you by some chance did not need it before you need arimidex now to lower E2. How much would depend on bloodwork.

Chances are you have high E2 due to this odd protocol you have created. Get blood work, then treat the E2 as needed.


#8

Im sry im gonna check my thyroid numbers and exact prolactin and cortisol. I feel desperate to start feeling good thats why i add my own testosterone, doctors said thyroid was fine thats why i didnt think about it but then again they are the ones who said my t was fine aswell.

Its just difficult to get anywhere with them here, one even told me estrogen is female hormone so dont need to control it.

I have arimidex at home so maybe i should try small dose? Well first i need to find out my e2, if my doctor dont post it soon i try find a private clinic and test it.

My e2 before trt was below range, thats why i thought it might not be high enough to cause problems with my trt, but given im on total 175mg test E a week plus 5mg of gel a day maybe i need it now. I dont have any other e2 symptoms tho only lethargy and feeling tired, some random headache aswell


#9

You need to be injecting T twice a week, once a week is not good enough. With once a week, lab results are mostly determined by lab timing.

Most guys would need 1.5mg anastrozole per week with that T dose. Some are over-responders who crash E2, and feel bad, then needing 1/4th the expected dose after stopping for 5-6 days to wash out.

Always to labs halfway between injections to minimize lab timing effects.

When you do not post all of your lab data, we are playing with half a deck of cards and important details can be missed. You need to post more data about you as per the advice for new guys sticky.


#10

Ok thx im gonna do a readup on all my labs tonight and then update this thread with posts all from the beginning too. I would kill to have a doc to test my blood whenever i wanted but male sexual health seem to be far from a priority in my country


#11

Male hormone health care is in a bad state in every country except in the USA. In the USA, most doctors are idiots, but a few are good, so it is difficult to find a doctor to get things done right and then it is expensive most of the time.

Some doctors are unwilling.
Some doctors are willing, lack knowledge and are dangerous.
Some doctors have their hands tied by medical insurance.
Some doctors provide care under insurance.
Some doctors do not take insurance and are expensive and lack knowledge.
Some doctors do not take insurance and are expensive and do things right.
Ignorance rules and doctors do not study, that was medical school. They can memorize things but fail at deductive reasoning and critical thought.

Other than that, I really don’t have any opinion. :thinking:


#12

Yea thank god for the internet. Without it i would have beleived my doc when she said 5nmol testosterone is no problem and i would have gone on with life having no idea it was actually the main reason i couldnt get a hardon in my late 20s lol


#13

Update with all my latest labs, tyroid status, levels before and under threatment.

After fighting the doctors for over a years time, showing these values, I finally got put on TRT:

Testosterone: 5nmol (ref 8.6 - 35nmol)
LH: 6.0 (ref 1.0-10)
FSH: 2.0 (ref 1.0-9)
SHBG: 19nmol (10-80)
Prolactin: 20ug/L (5-15)
S–IGF1: 247 (96-248)
S–Kortisol 519nmol (170-500)
S–Östradiol <40 pmol/L (41,4-159)

Testosterone: 6.0 (8.6-35nmol)
LH: 6.0 (1.0-10)
FSH: 2.0 (1.0-9)
Prolactin: 24ug/L (5-15)
SHBG: 20nmol (10-80)
S–IGF1: 232 (96-248)
S–Kortisol 396nmol (170-500)
S–Östradiol <40 pmol/L (41,4-159)

Testosterone: 5.5 (8.6-35nmol)
LH: 7.2 (1.0-10)
FSH: 2.4(1.0-9)
Prolactin: 22ug/L (5-15)
SHBG: 24nmol (10-80)
S–IGF1: 243 (96-248)
S–Kortisol 523nmol (170-500)
S–Östradiol <40 pmol/L (41,4-159)

My tyroid profile:

free T4 18,6 (12,0 - 22,0)
free T3 5,6 (3,1 - 6.8)
TSH 2,01mE/L (0,40 - 4,00)

Tested two times, the second time about the same values.

About 2 months ago I got put on 50mg testogel a day, after 6 weeks I tested my blood and this came back:

Testosterone: 17.0 (8.6-35nmol)
SHBG: 13 (18-54)
S–Kortisol 526nmol (170-500)
Prolactin: 21ug/L (5-15)
S–Östradiol: Labs haddnt got to the doctor yet, despite it being 3 weeks ago, a damn mess.

8th of June, I decided to add my own test E cause I didnt feel especially good. 125mg of testosterone every 5th day - IE total 175mg per week. At the same time, I added finasteride for hair loss. I kept up with the gel every day cause I know testosterone E takes a while to “take effect” in the body.

A week after I started feeling “slow” in my head, almost like an old man. Weird brain fog and lethargic. I dropped my finasteride immidately.

Today the fog is somewhat gone, a little bit left, but Im still lethargic and unmotivated.

Status of libido: Decent/good, I wanna have sex once a day now - before threatment I didnt want sex at all.

Status of morning wood: Hard morning wood every morning.

I do not know how long it will take for the estradiol test to get to my doctor, the doc wanted new tests in 3 months … zzz, I also dont know where to test my estradiol privately, gonna try find some place but not sure if there is any here.

Thoughts? How should I proceed from here you think?


#14

I also have a low ringing in my ears the last couple of days, no idea why that would be as ive never had any tinnitus


#15

Any comments of my updated labs?