T Nation

2 Questions on Shoulder Presses

  1. Could someone answer this servey on how the perfect dumbell shoulder press shoulder be done that thickens and increases the size of the entire shoulder area (mostly the lateral head):

a) palms facing: completely forward, a little up, towards thhe ceiling, doesnt matter

b) Sitting position: With back support (on a 90 degree inlined bench, no back support

And no offense to anyone, but could a moderator or someone who has alot of experience with overhead presses answer these please?

  1. In a book ive read, i heard that when doing any kind of overhead press where you push the weight straight over head, the lateral head actually does the work of pushing the weight up. If this is so why is it that i keep reading around in articles and sites that the anterior delts are the targeted muscle of shoulder press?

[quote]GM rauf 07 wrote:

  1. Could someone answer this servey on how the perfect dumbell shoulder press shoulder be done that thickens and increases the size of the entire shoulder area (mostly the lateral head):

a) palms facing: completely forward, a little up, towards thhe ceiling, doesnt matter[/quote]

I would say it isnt a locked position rotates from palms facing forward at the very top locked out position to rotating a bit inward maybe even as far as facing you at the bottom dependent on how much ROM you use. This IMO eliminate much negative strain.

[quote]
b) Sitting position: With back support (on a 90 degree inlined bench, no back support [/quote]

neither stand your lazy ass up and take advantage of the static workout your sore will get by having to stabilize you.

[quote]
And no offense to anyone, but could a moderator or someone who has alot of experience with overhead presses answer these please?

  1. In a book ive read, i heard that when doing any kind of overhead press where you push the weight straight over head, the lateral head actually does the work of pushing the weight up. If this is so why is it that i keep reading around in articles and sites that the anterior delts are the targeted muscle of shoulder press?[/quote]

Sorry im leaving this one for some one else. This is also so damn form and grip dependent. where your plane of motion is more infront of you or out to the side yada yada.

[quote]GM rauf 07 wrote:

  1. Could someone answer this servey on how the perfect dumbell shoulder press shoulder be done that thickens and increases the size of the entire shoulder area (mostly the lateral head):

a) palms facing: completely forward, a little up, towards thhe ceiling, doesnt matter

b) Sitting position: With back support (on a 90 degree inlined bench, no back support

And no offense to anyone, but could a moderator or someone who has alot of experience with overhead presses answer these please?

  1. In a book ive read, i heard that when doing any kind of overhead press where you push the weight straight over head, the lateral head actually does the work of pushing the weight up. If this is so why is it that i keep reading around in articles and sites that the anterior delts are the targeted muscle of shoulder press?[/quote]

It is hard to understand your writing, but I’ll answer my best.

All overhead pressing will work all three heads of the delts, but with varying percentages.

Standing presses work more lateral and rear delt than seated, because you don’t lean back as much.

Dumbbell presses and behind neck presses work more lateral and rear delt due to the leverage not being out in front as much.

Some people struggle with standing military presses due to low back pain. Some people struggle with seated presses with no back support due to balance issues. Some people lean back so much on seated presses that they are really doing a steep incline.

When you get strong, you won’t be able to manipulate your palm positioning because you’ll be trying to get a good grip on the heavy ass weight!

Do them all and see which version works best for you.

[quote]bretc wrote:
GM rauf 07 wrote:

  1. Could someone answer this servey on how the perfect dumbell shoulder press shoulder be done that thickens and increases the size of the entire shoulder area (mostly the lateral head):

a) palms facing: completely forward, a little up, towards thhe ceiling, doesnt matter

b) Sitting position: With back support (on a 90 degree inlined bench, no back support

And no offense to anyone, but could a moderator or someone who has alot of experience with overhead presses answer these please?

  1. In a book ive read, i heard that when doing any kind of overhead press where you push the weight straight over head, the lateral head actually does the work of pushing the weight up. If this is so why is it that i keep reading around in articles and sites that the anterior delts are the targeted muscle of shoulder press?

It is hard to understand your writing, but I’ll answer my best.

All overhead pressing will work all three heads of the delts, but with varying percentages.

Standing presses work more lateral and rear delt than seated, because you don’t lean back as much.

Dumbbell presses and behind neck presses work more lateral and rear delt due to the leverage not being out in front as much.

Some people struggle with standing military presses due to low back pain. Some people struggle with seated presses with no back support due to balance issues. Some people lean back so much on seated presses that they are really doing a steep incline.

When you get strong, you won’t be able to manipulate your palm positioning because you’ll be trying to get a good grip on the heavy ass weight!

Do them all and see which version works best for you. [/quote]

yea sorry about the few typos i should have re-read it.

So now i truely know overhead presses where the weight is completely abducted or behind your neck with the elbows facing a little towards your back also work the rear delts. Would it be good to do dumbell shoulder presses with the weights a little bit behind your head? And if it is bad for the shoulder joints, is there any way to not let it be?

You’re overthinking this, man. Go do some shoulder presses. A lot. See where you’re sore the next day? Do accessory work for where you’re not sore.

My anterior delts are overpowering my laterals because I’m a delt bencher and I do a lot of overhead stuff. And until recently, I didn’t do much for my lateral delts. had I taken my own advice (above), I wouldn’t be in this situation.

Check this page for specifics on movements for shoulders.

exrx.net/Lists/ExList/ShouldWt.html#anchor1933886

Movements in bold target the specified muscles more (in the opinion of the page authors)

IMHO, I’m pretty sure, based on origins and insertions, that any overhead shoulder press regardless of grip targets the anterior deltoid, primarily.

Lateral deltiods require upright rows and probably supplementary work with lateral flies.

This is my opinion. I am sure some will insist their way is the best way. I’m not saying that mine is. Find what works for you and get after it.

Here is an image of the anterior deltoid, note the origin and insertion. www.exrx.net/Muscles/DeltoidAnterior.html

Imagine the arm in the start position for shoulder press, and it is obvious the anterior deltoid will shorten with the movement. Since muscles only generate force by contration, this should make it clear how it works.

Here is the lateral deltoid
www.exrx.net/Muscles/DeltoidLateral.html

Imagine the movement of the shoulder press, and you will see the lateral deltoid essentially doesn’t move. It helps stabilize the weight for control, but that’s about it.

Like a previous poster said. Try it for yourself. Get a light weight and rep out and see where you start to “feel the burn” for each of these movements.

Hope this was helpful.

Short and sweet, stick to the basics mate. They have worked for longer the some cant count years.

I find stand mil press and push press the best for shoulder strength.

Alright i’ll just try different things and see what works good. thanks.