T Nation

2 questions for 2 experts

Bill Roberts: if 4AD is for long-term use, what is your recommendations for a cut-off point in weeks for MAG-10? I want to use one or the other for 6 weeks. Which is best?

John Berardi: In your article last week you recommended cottage cheese and a high GI cereal for your first "real food" post-workout meal. Would you mind giving some examples of cereals?


? for John-
Wouldn’t you want to choose something non casein to get absorbed faster? That is what confused me about the cottage cheese choice. thanks.

For your question to John about which cereal to consume, Vector (from Kelloggs)is a solid choice.

JC, you should keep in mind that the “post -workout” meal has already been consumed. That meal provided the more readily digested whey/BCAA. On the other hand, this next meal provides (as casein is consumed) a more sustained release of aminos into circulation.

If in Canada - Vector or Vive

If in the US - Smart Start

They all taste great, are higher in protein than most cereals, and have a good macro profile.

Doesn’t Vector have soy in it? John, your thoughts on soy?

I knew this one would come up…

There is only a minimal amt of soy in the cereal and at 1-2 servings per day, that’s not very much soy. In fact, I use Vector and skim milk to feed my subjects for experiments where food intake must be controlled. They all still have their male genitalia.

As you can tell, Im not as anti-soy as many of my t-mag colleagues.

A portion of cereal VIVE + 1 scoop of Chocolate whey is the best meal(Taste) of my life ! ehehe

thanks for clarifying, i was a little bit confused.

Ok, I understand the part about taking in a protein (cottage cheese) that takes longer to digest as your first post training real-food meal but…why the high GI cereal (vs. low)? Are we still able to absorb higher amounts of protein during this meal at this time? Am I on the right path of thinking here? Up until now, I have been taking in lower GI cereals with minimal sugar content. Smart Start has a pretty decent macro~nutrient profile but is also much higher than say plain 'ol oatmeal on the GI chart. Help me out on this one if you can John. Also, thanks so much for your knowledge and information that you constantly fill our brains with. I soak it up and always look forward to hearing the latest. Just started with a few clients using your anaerobic 1:3 ratio and am looking forward to seeing them break through some stubborn plateaus with this. Keith

I think Smart Start has soy in it, unfortunately. It tastes great, though.

just bumping this back to the top. i was sort of wondering the same thing as keith. also , i thought that the 2:1 macro ratio for carbs and protein when they enter the blood stream SIMULTANEOUSLY was supposed to be best for post workout nutrition. what is the benefit of taking a very slow protein (cottage cheese) at the same time as a faster acting carb like cereal. i kinda figured it would be best to either do something like cottage cheese and oatmeal (both slow) or cereal and whey (both fast) that way the carbs and protein would be entering the blood stream around the same time?

According to the label, cottage cheese does contain some whey protein. I would think that you’re getting a little fast - acting protein and some long - acting protein, maybe in a decrescendo - type pattern.

If no recovery agents (Clomid, or Tribex + Vitex, or Tribex + M) are used then 2 weeks for MAG-10. If recovery agents are available, then longer cycles like 8 weeks are completely feasible but, long term, you may well be happier with short cycles. Among other reasons, shorter times on allow shorter times off. You can be “on” only 1/3 of the time with short cycles yet never suffer any serious decline, but of course, being “on” 1/3 of the time with say 8 week cycles means being off 16 weeks.