Not to stirr anyting up, but i found a comment from Nelson Montana on another forum regarding two week on/off.
Quote:
"2 weeks is TOO short. That was Bill Roberts moronic theory based on my findings . He suggested 2 on, 2off, which would be a disaster.
A 4 week cycle is fine for a maiden voyage.
Use an oral up front as a kick start. For the millionth time, short acting esters are no faster, only shorter. Steroids DO NOT take weeks to kick in. They are active immediately."
Bill Roberts didn’t base the 2on2off cylce on Nelson Montana’s work, IIRC it originated with a Greek athlete, I don’t remember his name. Bill never claimed that it was an original idea either.
Why would 2 on 2 off be a disaster? Did Nelson Montana explain his statement?
According to Bill Roberts, the problem with going over 2 weeks is that you lose the ability to recover almost immediately. That’s why it is suggested that if you are going to go over 2 weeks, you might as well go 6+ weeks.
Jmill: correct. After 14 days, recovery becomes more difficult.
Despite what the gentleman said on another board, I have found 2 on, 2 off to be productive and with little to no sides.
Purely anecdotal evidence. I have been playing with the idea of trying 3 on 3 off, just to compare.
[quote]OTS1 wrote:
Jmill: correct. After 14 days, recovery becomes more difficult.
Despite what the gentleman said on another board, I have found 2 on, 2 off to be productive and with little to no sides.
Purely anecdotal evidence. I have been playing with the idea of trying 3 on 3 off, just to compare.
[/quote]
Wasn’t there a three week experiment done here a while back?
I believe you are right… I’ll check it out
Anyone have any thoughts on using transdermals on these cycles? I am playing with the idea of using transdermal testosterone on a 2-weeker. Prop always cripples me even at low doses and I’ve had a good amount of Testosterone Base powder sitting around for a while now that I purchased a while back at a nice price. What I’m concerned about is how fast transdermals are out of your system. I’ve heard that blood levels are more “steady” with transdermals vs. injections, which leads me to wonder how quick it would be out of the system. Of course with the 2-weekers we want compounds that are in and out of the system as quick as possible, preferably with half lives of 24-48 hrs max.
I know you need to use a lot to get a decent effect given that only a fraction of the compound will be properly absorbed, but I just need 100-200 effective mg per week of Testosterone (as part of a stack) to get the effects I am after so that isn’t really a concern to me, especially considering how cheap I got the raw powder and that I have nothing else to do with it really.
[quote]Rational Gaze wrote:
Bill Roberts didn’t base the 2on2off cylce on Nelson Montana’s work, IIRC it originated with a Greek athlete, I don’t remember his name. Bill never claimed that it was an original idea either.
Why would 2 on 2 off be a disaster? Did Nelson Montana explain his statement?[/quote]
No, not in a very constructive way. I just figured that Nelson Montana was another renown person preaching the ultra short cycle. So reading his statement was a suprise for me.
[quote]smith machine wrote:
BTW
Drol actually doesnt aromatize or convert to estrogen but does cause estrogenic sides, so the adex wont help here (but will help with the test p obviously)[/quote]
Ive heard many guys say that letro seemed to quiet many of the side effects, although this makes little sense…the estrogenic/progesterinic sides really make no sense in the first place either.
My theory is that it does stimulate the receptors, and by driving your actual estrogen much lower than normal, it obviously will not stimulate the receptors, and you eliminate any “high estrogen issues” but still experience normal libido, etc. because the receptors are being stimulated by the drol.
Adex simply isn’t strong enough to drive your estrogen that low unless dosed excessively, but letro certainly could do so with a dosage that would not seem “excessive” to the average guy, with letro, 10ths of a mg matter significantly, a very small adjustment in the drug can have a very significant effect.
That sounded confusing, but it seems like a very simply concept, and the theory fits with anecdotal evidence.
I’m on day 6 of Drol, and so far, I prefer it to DBOL, and find it much milder. I seem to have estro issues with dbol above and beyond any other drug.
My only issue with the drol is I seem to want to sleep forever. No noticible effects once I get out of bed.
Ok, I’ve never posted a pic here, so here’s my first chickenshit attempt. Current weight 227
Well, that was even lower quality than I thought. I’ll post something else soon.
[quote]OTS1 wrote:
I’m on day 6 of Drol, and so far, I prefer it to DBOL, and find it much milder. I seem to have estro issues with dbol above and beyond any other drug.
My only issue with the drol is I seem to want to sleep forever. No noticible effects once I get out of bed.
[/quote]
Are you comparing 50mg of Drol to 50mg of Dianabol?
Did you try using an AI to combat the estrogen issues with Dianabol?
I am. I found that even at 1mg/day adex with 50mg dbol, I got estro sides, including tingly nips
OK, first 2 weeker is over. 100mg/day TP (frontloaded) with 50mg/day drol
Happy with results. No noticable test. atrophy, no HCG used.
I found the drol to be milder than same dose of dbol, as far as sides (estro), but about equally effective. Next time, I will try 100mg
I’ll be running 1 week of clomid @50/day for first off week
[quote]OTS1 wrote:
OK, first 2 weeker is over. 100mg/day TP (frontloaded) with 50mg/day drol
Happy with results. No noticable test. atrophy, no HCG used.
I found the drol to be milder than same dose of dbol, as far as sides (estro), but about equally effective. Next time, I will try 100mg
I’ll be running 1 week of clomid @50/day for first off week[/quote]
Good mate good to see its going well.
I had the same experience as you with dbol/drol
I will be watching curious to see how your strength gains go in the next two weeks
[quote]Westclock wrote:
[quote]smith machine wrote:
BTW
Drol actually doesnt aromatize or convert to estrogen but does cause estrogenic sides, so the adex wont help here (but will help with the test p obviously)[/quote]
Ive heard many guys say that letro seemed to quiet many of the side effects, although this makes little sense…the estrogenic/progesterinic sides really make no sense in the first place either.
My theory is that it does stimulate the receptors, and by driving your actual estrogen much lower than normal, it obviously will not stimulate the receptors, and you eliminate any “high estrogen issues” but still experience normal libido, etc. because the receptors are being stimulated by the drol.
Adex simply isn’t strong enough to drive your estrogen that low unless dosed excessively, but letro certainly could do so with a dosage that would not seem “excessive” to the average guy, with letro, 10ths of a mg matter significantly, a very small adjustment in the drug can have a very significant effect.
That sounded confusing, but it seems like a very simply concept, and the theory fits with anecdotal evidence.[/quote]
+1