T Nation

1st Cycle Help, Information Needed


#13

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Ned wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]bestlifter wrote:
What are ur lifting stats? Id realy like to see a pic, cause of thats impressive low bodyfat%

10 weeks of 500mg test e ew is enough for first cycle in my opinion… Pct use nolva 20mg ed for six weeks, two weeks after last pin.[/quote]

sure man hmm bench is at 335
squat is at 390
deadlift ive hit 495 for one but right now im playing more around the 420 region cause of low caloric intakes and what not.

ill post a picture later on im on my work pc now. The thing is I really want to stack something with test. I know that for a first cycle test alone is you really need but im feeling cheeky ;)[/quote]

With stats like that as a natty, WTF would you mess with it for?

There is a possibility that you wont recover your natural production to where it is at now. Then what?
[/quote]

dude. if his stats were shitty, you’d tell him to lift more first. so because his stats are good, you’re telling him he doesn’t need to use? get real. maybe he wants to go farther in bodybuilding than staying natural will allow.

OP, I would stick with just test for your first cycle, unless you have a VERY good reason for using the primo as well. You want to understand how your body reacts to different drugs at different dosages. If things don’t ‘feel right’ in this cycle, you won’t know what to adjust, because you’ve never run either compound before. At most, I would add in an oral, because oral’s are so fast acting. They’re easy to adjust.[/quote]

So something like var? Or stronger?[/quote]

Var would be fine. It’s not a weak compound. D bol is good too, unless you have a contest in your immediate future. It will make you hold a bit of water.

AI stands for Aromatase Inhibitor. It’s widely agreed that one should be run in most steroid cycles to manage estrogen side effects. There are rare exceptions to this rule. Arimidex (Anastrozole) at .25mg every other day should be sufficient for the cycle you intend to run.


#14

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Ned wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]bestlifter wrote:
What are ur lifting stats? Id realy like to see a pic, cause of thats impressive low bodyfat%

10 weeks of 500mg test e ew is enough for first cycle in my opinion… Pct use nolva 20mg ed for six weeks, two weeks after last pin.[/quote]

sure man hmm bench is at 335
squat is at 390
deadlift ive hit 495 for one but right now im playing more around the 420 region cause of low caloric intakes and what not.

ill post a picture later on im on my work pc now. The thing is I really want to stack something with test. I know that for a first cycle test alone is you really need but im feeling cheeky ;)[/quote]

With stats like that as a natty, WTF would you mess with it for?

There is a possibility that you wont recover your natural production to where it is at now. Then what?
[/quote]

dude. if his stats were shitty, you’d tell him to lift more first. so because his stats are good, you’re telling him he doesn’t need to use? get real. maybe he wants to go farther in bodybuilding than staying natural will allow.

OP, I would stick with just test for your first cycle, unless you have a VERY good reason for using the primo as well. You want to understand how your body reacts to different drugs at different dosages. If things don’t ‘feel right’ in this cycle, you won’t know what to adjust, because you’ve never run either compound before. At most, I would add in an oral, because oral’s are so fast acting. They’re easy to adjust.[/quote]

So something like var? Or stronger?[/quote]

Var would be fine. It’s not a weak compound. D bol is good too, unless you have a contest in your immediate future. It will make you hold a bit of water.

AI stands for Aromatase Inhibitor. It’s widely agreed that one should be run in most steroid cycles to manage estrogen side effects. There are rare exceptions to this rule. Arimidex (Anastrozole) at .25mg every other day should be sufficient for the cycle you intend to run.[/quote]

Okok I appriacte all this information now the thing is I’ll be honest with you I know the type of person I am and it sounds stupid but I want to be swinging at the fences with this. So hypothetically speaking if I were to add something other than var (seeing as I want to put on 10-15lbs of quality mass) would you prefer primo or eq and mast. And once again I know you suggested neither and sticking with test only but I’ll probably end up doing it anyway and I would prefer being educated before hand. And it seems to me as you know your stuff pretty darn well. Also this is what I look like


#15

I run letro 2.5 ED during my cycles.

In my humble opinion, test, deca, and tren is simply an amazing stack. The strength and size gains are unreal when coupled with the right training and diet.


#16

Impressive as fuck for a natty.

Make sure to run an AI. I’d run adex, easier to dose than letro. Letro gets tricky. 0.25 or 0.5 adex eod.

Just run a basic test cycle… 500mg a week. If you want throw in an oral like var or dbol and you would be great.


#17

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Ned wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]bestlifter wrote:
What are ur lifting stats? Id realy like to see a pic, cause of thats impressive low bodyfat%

10 weeks of 500mg test e ew is enough for first cycle in my opinion… Pct use nolva 20mg ed for six weeks, two weeks after last pin.[/quote]

sure man hmm bench is at 335
squat is at 390
deadlift ive hit 495 for one but right now im playing more around the 420 region cause of low caloric intakes and what not.

ill post a picture later on im on my work pc now. The thing is I really want to stack something with test. I know that for a first cycle test alone is you really need but im feeling cheeky ;)[/quote]

With stats like that as a natty, WTF would you mess with it for?

There is a possibility that you wont recover your natural production to where it is at now. Then what?
[/quote]

dude. if his stats were shitty, you’d tell him to lift more first. so because his stats are good, you’re telling him he doesn’t need to use? get real. maybe he wants to go farther in bodybuilding than staying natural will allow.

OP, I would stick with just test for your first cycle, unless you have a VERY good reason for using the primo as well. You want to understand how your body reacts to different drugs at different dosages. If things don’t ‘feel right’ in this cycle, you won’t know what to adjust, because you’ve never run either compound before. At most, I would add in an oral, because oral’s are so fast acting. They’re easy to adjust.[/quote]

So something like var? Or stronger?[/quote]

Var would be fine. It’s not a weak compound. D bol is good too, unless you have a contest in your immediate future. It will make you hold a bit of water.

AI stands for Aromatase Inhibitor. It’s widely agreed that one should be run in most steroid cycles to manage estrogen side effects. There are rare exceptions to this rule. Arimidex (Anastrozole) at .25mg every other day should be sufficient for the cycle you intend to run.[/quote]

Okok I appriacte all this information now the thing is I’ll be honest with you I know the type of person I am and it sounds stupid but I want to be swinging at the fences with this. So hypothetically speaking if I were to add something other than var (seeing as I want to put on 10-15lbs of quality mass) would you prefer primo or eq and mast. And once again I know you suggested neither and sticking with test only but I’ll probably end up doing it anyway and I would prefer being educated before hand. And it seems to me as you know your stuff pretty darn well. Also this is what I look like [/quote]

Well…

Let me ask you this. What do you believe the benefit of running any of these compounds would be for you? Why not just double the test dose instead? Masteron and Primo are pretty similar for most people, so between those 2 it’s probably a toss up. I haven’t run EQ, but I’ve strongly considered it, and would probably try that first. If you’re really set on going hard though, consider tren. It’s definitely going to be the most potent thing you can run. I don’t recommend it for a first cycle, but it will be the drug most suited to your goals.

If you can afford it, I’d run the var as well, even if you go with multiple injectables. I see no reason not to if you have the money for it. Var is great for making substantial changes in body composition.


#18

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Ned wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]bestlifter wrote:
What are ur lifting stats? Id realy like to see a pic, cause of thats impressive low bodyfat%

10 weeks of 500mg test e ew is enough for first cycle in my opinion… Pct use nolva 20mg ed for six weeks, two weeks after last pin.[/quote]

sure man hmm bench is at 335
squat is at 390
deadlift ive hit 495 for one but right now im playing more around the 420 region cause of low caloric intakes and what not.

ill post a picture later on im on my work pc now. The thing is I really want to stack something with test. I know that for a first cycle test alone is you really need but im feeling cheeky ;)[/quote]

With stats like that as a natty, WTF would you mess with it for?

There is a possibility that you wont recover your natural production to where it is at now. Then what?
[/quote]

dude. if his stats were shitty, you’d tell him to lift more first. so because his stats are good, you’re telling him he doesn’t need to use? get real. maybe he wants to go farther in bodybuilding than staying natural will allow.

OP, I would stick with just test for your first cycle, unless you have a VERY good reason for using the primo as well. You want to understand how your body reacts to different drugs at different dosages. If things don’t ‘feel right’ in this cycle, you won’t know what to adjust, because you’ve never run either compound before. At most, I would add in an oral, because oral’s are so fast acting. They’re easy to adjust.[/quote]

So something like var? Or stronger?[/quote]

Var would be fine. It’s not a weak compound. D bol is good too, unless you have a contest in your immediate future. It will make you hold a bit of water.

AI stands for Aromatase Inhibitor. It’s widely agreed that one should be run in most steroid cycles to manage estrogen side effects. There are rare exceptions to this rule. Arimidex (Anastrozole) at .25mg every other day should be sufficient for the cycle you intend to run.[/quote]

Okok I appriacte all this information now the thing is I’ll be honest with you I know the type of person I am and it sounds stupid but I want to be swinging at the fences with this. So hypothetically speaking if I were to add something other than var (seeing as I want to put on 10-15lbs of quality mass) would you prefer primo or eq and mast. And once again I know you suggested neither and sticking with test only but I’ll probably end up doing it anyway and I would prefer being educated before hand. And it seems to me as you know your stuff pretty darn well. Also this is what I look like [/quote]

Well…

Let me ask you this. What do you believe the benefit of running any of these compounds would be for you? Why not just double the test dose instead? Masteron and Primo are pretty similar for most people, so between those 2 it’s probably a toss up. I haven’t run EQ, but I’ve strongly considered it, and would probably try that first. If you’re really set on going hard though, consider tren. It’s definitely going to be the most potent thing you can run. I don’t recommend it for a first cycle, but it will be the drug most suited to your goals.

If you can afford it, I’d run the var as well, even if you go with multiple injectables. I see no reason not to if you have the money for it. Var is great for making substantial changes in body composition. [/quote]

I know eq increases appetite and vascularity so that I’m for sure down! The toss up between mast and primo is because simply I do not want to deal with the hair loss I really don’t


#19

[quote]nooberific wrote:
Impressive as fuck for a natty.

Make sure to run an AI. I’d run adex, easier to dose than letro. Letro gets tricky. 0.25 or 0.5 adex eod.

Just run a basic test cycle… 500mg a week. If you want throw in an oral like var or dbol and you would be great.[/quote]

Do I start the adex right away or I’ve heard I wait for my cycle to end ? Or is that for the pct? Sorry for being a noon


#20

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]nooberific wrote:
Impressive as fuck for a natty.

Make sure to run an AI. I’d run adex, easier to dose than letro. Letro gets tricky. 0.25 or 0.5 adex eod.

Just run a basic test cycle… 500mg a week. If you want throw in an oral like var or dbol and you would be great.[/quote]

Do I start the adex right away or I’ve heard I wait for my cycle to end ? Or is that for the pct? Sorry for being a noon [/quote]

You want to run it your whole cycle into PCT.
I’d run EQ with var or dbol. Cycle sort of like this:

Wk 1-14 Test-E 500-750mg/wk
Wk 1-12 EQ 600mg/wk
Wk 1-4 Dbol 40mg/day
Wk 1-16 Adex 0.25mg eod — taper accordingly

PCT
Wk 16-22 Nolva 20/20/20/20/20/20 or run 40 first two weeks and 20 last 4.

this cycle done right will probably put on 20-30lbs but you can cut after and maintain 15lbs of lean muscle after cycle


#21

Looking good. How many times have you been accused of being on da roidz?


#22

[quote]nooberific wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]nooberific wrote:
Impressive as fuck for a natty.

Make sure to run an AI. I’d run adex, easier to dose than letro. Letro gets tricky. 0.25 or 0.5 adex eod.

Just run a basic test cycle… 500mg a week. If you want throw in an oral like var or dbol and you would be great.[/quote]

Do I start the adex right away or I’ve heard I wait for my cycle to end ? Or is that for the pct? Sorry for being a noon [/quote]

You want to run it your whole cycle into PCT.
I’d run EQ with var or dbol. Cycle sort of like this:

Wk 1-14 Test-E 500-750mg/wk
Wk 1-12 EQ 600mg/wk
Wk 1-4 Dbol 40mg/day
Wk 1-16 Adex 0.25mg eod — taper accordingly

PCT
Wk 16-22 Nolva 20/20/20/20/20/20 or run 40 first two weeks and 20 last 4.

this cycle done right will probably put on 20-30lbs but you can cut after and maintain 15lbs of lean muscle after cycle
[/quote]

The only reason why I don’t want dbol is because I don’t want to blow up in size I want to keep my gains and weight below 10% and knowing my metabolism dbol will blow me. I wanted masteron from the start but I’m just scared of the hair loss part so I thought maybe primo would be better?


#23

[quote]dt79 wrote:
Looking good. How many times have you been accused of being on da roidz? [/quote]

Not as much as you would think aha


#24

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]nooberific wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]nooberific wrote:
Impressive as fuck for a natty.

Make sure to run an AI. I’d run adex, easier to dose than letro. Letro gets tricky. 0.25 or 0.5 adex eod.

Just run a basic test cycle… 500mg a week. If you want throw in an oral like var or dbol and you would be great.[/quote]

Do I start the adex right away or I’ve heard I wait for my cycle to end ? Or is that for the pct? Sorry for being a noon [/quote]

You want to run it your whole cycle into PCT.
I’d run EQ with var or dbol. Cycle sort of like this:

Wk 1-14 Test-E 500-750mg/wk
Wk 1-12 EQ 600mg/wk
Wk 1-4 Dbol 40mg/day
Wk 1-16 Adex 0.25mg eod — taper accordingly

PCT
Wk 16-22 Nolva 20/20/20/20/20/20 or run 40 first two weeks and 20 last 4.

this cycle done right will probably put on 20-30lbs but you can cut after and maintain 15lbs of lean muscle after cycle
[/quote]

The only reason why I don’t want dbol is because I don’t want to blow up in size I want to keep my gains and weight below 10% and knowing my metabolism dbol will blow me. I wanted masteron from the start but I’m just scared of the hair loss part so I thought maybe primo would be better?[/quote]

Then run var at like 75mg/day. I’ve never taken var so I really have no experience with dosing but I think most people recommend 50-100mg a day?


#25

Alright, hold on. You really need to read the stickies because you still have a lack of understanding about the basics. This way, if any problem comes up, you won’t be all over the place and going back and forth while trying to find a solution.


#26

[quote]dt79 wrote:

Alright, hold on. You really need to read the stickies because you still have a lack of understanding about the basics. This way, if any problem comes up, you won’t be all over the place and going back and forth while trying to find a solution.[/quote]

I’ve read this it doesn’t really answer my debate between mast eq vs primo ahaha that’s all I really want an answer to honestly. I appreciate all the insight I’m getting and I an extremely greatful but I just need to know which is a better rout to go


#27

Mixing different compounds during cycle does not mean better gains… Mast might make u look better during cycle… Eq might help u with apetite… Increasing test might make u gain more muscle…

We dont know whats best for u, How u will react… Think about risks vs rewards before u start injecting and read about the sides of the different steroids…

What if u go bald just because u wanted to use an extra compound u didnt need for your goal in the first place…


#28

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]dt79 wrote:

Alright, hold on. You really need to read the stickies because you still have a lack of understanding about the basics. This way, if any problem comes up, you won’t be all over the place and going back and forth while trying to find a solution.[/quote]

I’ve read this it doesn’t really answer my debate between mast eq vs primo ahaha that’s all I really want an answer to honestly. I appreciate all the insight I’m getting and I an extremely greatful but I just need to know which is a better rout to go [/quote]

we’re realllllly trying to help here, but you seem to think you already have the answers, even though you don’t understand some very basic concepts. You’re not looking at the big picture, and you will NEED to know more if you want to cycle without developing serious problems. You need to be able to answer these questions, and more:

  1. How do I maintain low estrogen, without crashing it?
  2. What do I do in the event that I have estrogenic side effects, such as puffy nipples?
  3. How do I maintain a reasonable blood pressure?
  4. What do I do if blood pressure gets higher than I’m willing to deal with?
  5. How do I come off cycle (PCT)?
  6. What do I do if PCT doesn’t work?
  7. What do I do if I lose my appetite?
  8. What liver enzyme values should I look at when I get bloodwork done?
  9. What values are acceptable short-term, what are not?
  10. What should I do when liver values reach unacceptable levels?
  11. What is an AI, and how does it work?
  12. How does a SERM function differently from an AI?
  13. What are the differences between the various SERMS and AI’s available?

These are just a few questions I thought of off the top of my head. Can you answer them? Every one of them is important.


#29

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]sarkis1994 wrote:

[quote]dt79 wrote:

Alright, hold on. You really need to read the stickies because you still have a lack of understanding about the basics. This way, if any problem comes up, you won’t be all over the place and going back and forth while trying to find a solution.[/quote]

I’ve read this it doesn’t really answer my debate between mast eq vs primo ahaha that’s all I really want an answer to honestly. I appreciate all the insight I’m getting and I an extremely greatful but I just need to know which is a better rout to go [/quote]

we’re realllllly trying to help here, but you seem to think you already have the answers, even though you don’t understand some very basic concepts. You’re not looking at the big picture, and you will NEED to know more if you want to cycle without developing serious problems. You need to be able to answer these questions, and more:

  1. How do I maintain low estrogen, without crashing it?
  2. What do I do in the event that I have estrogenic side effects, such as puffy nipples?
  3. How do I maintain a reasonable blood pressure?
  4. What do I do if blood pressure gets higher than I’m willing to deal with?
  5. How do I come off cycle (PCT)?
  6. What do I do if PCT doesn’t work?
  7. What do I do if I lose my appetite?
  8. What liver enzyme values should I look at when I get bloodwork done?
  9. What values are acceptable short-term, what are not?
  10. What should I do when liver values reach unacceptable levels?
  11. What is an AI, and how does it work?
  12. How does a SERM function differently from an AI?
  13. What are the differences between the various SERMS and AI’s available?

These are just a few questions I thought of off the top of my head. Can you answer them? Every one of them is important. [/quote]

Alright I really appreciate this. I decided to stick with test and eq only. Start with 500mg and see how my body works on it and how much I can increase the dosage. Thank you for helping and writing down all these. I’m going to be taking .5mg of adex throughout my cycle, hcg after my cycle and novadex after my hcg


#30

EQ is garbage.


#31

I personally love Eq. Mind you I am trying to maintain lower weight class, am a small eater, and love the vascularity. Didn’t read the thread to say anything else just saw Bauber was back so had to see what was up lol.


#32

[quote]Reed wrote:
I personally love Eq. Mind you I am trying to maintain lower weight class, am a small eater, and love the vascularity. Didn’t read the thread to say anything else just saw Bauber was back so had to see what was up lol.[/quote]

I have come across a few who like it, but most I know don’t. Maybe I just don’t have the receptors for it. It just doesn’t do much for me bad or good haha.