[quote]sully’s wrote:
The 1005 pound lift was a SQUAT.
He did bench 965. Still very impressive
Here is the link to his web site.
http://rychlakpowersystems.com/index.htm[/quote]
He did the 965 in 2003…
Hello All,
Since I am the one that started this thread I wanted to offer some additional thoughts…
First, I apologize for posting incorrect information. I read some postings on the internet and posted them here without verifying them. I should have done a better job. But if Dan Rather can do it…hehehe.
Secondly, I would like to offer my thoughts on the “gear vs. raw” debate. Who am I to offer such an opinion? Nobody. I am considered fat and out of shape by T-Nation standards. I am working hard to make it better, though, and am doing so with the knowledge found here. I am decidedly NOT a strength or bodybuilding insider. Does this make it inappropriate for me to offer thoughts on the matter? I hope not 'cause I’m going to. It might even be an advantage. Sometimes an outside perspective can be helpful. With that said, here goes.
Does this gentleman deserve recognition for putting up these numbers? Yes. However, the company making his equipment should have it’s name in the record books as well. I used to work at a gym. We had a group of guys that liked to shout and scream while lifting. None of them knew anything about doing things the right way (evidenced by the amount of weight they moved) but they liked the attention. I remember the day they discovered bench shirts. I personally observed one of them unable to pull his raw 1RM down to his chest. When I was young I would get called out by my mother if I stood with shoulders rounded forward…we called it “bad posture.” Indeed, many of the coaches that write for this website prescribe exercises and routines to correct such disfunctions and imbalences. Now, people are designing “clothes,” to encourage and cause such things. My conclusion: it is no longer about human performace increased through training, it is now about technological adavancement. This is not necessarily wrong or “impure” as long as the community is honest about it.
I would also like to talk about the Lance Armstrong reference made above. I do not think it a valid analogy. The force output necessary to succeed in Armstrong’s events is still coming from the human being whereas a significant portion of the force output necessary for the success in powerlifting is now coming from external technological sources. When Lance Armstrong begins entering races on a motorcycle, then the analogy will be appropriate.
Wow, this should generate some talk.
Regards,
Max
[quote]sully’s wrote:
The 1005 pound lift was a SQUAT.
He did bench 965. Still very impressive
Here is the link to his web site.
http://rychlakpowersystems.com/index.htm[/quote]
No, it has been confirmed that the 1005 was Gene’s bench. Gene’s website is outdated. He’s been busy training for 1000!
[quote]JSMaxwell wrote:
…Now, people are designing “clothes,” to encourage and cause such things. My conclusion: it is no longer about human performace increased through training, it is now about technological adavancement… [/quote]
Umm, OK. Anyone who is a competitive powerlifter will disagree with you on this. BTW, there is plenty of Human Performance and Biomechanicanical sciences in the sport of powerlifting.
Brian
This is like saying that people designed football pads to encourage tackling.
Re: the gear vs. raw, the raw bench record will almost certainly never be 1000 lbs, so there would be nothing to talk about on this thread.
RIT Jared
[quote]JSMaxwell wrote:
I would also like to talk about the Lance Armstrong reference made above. I do not think it a valid analogy. The force output necessary to succeed in Armstrong’s events is still coming from the human being whereas a significant portion of the force output necessary for the success in powerlifting is now coming from external technological sources. When Lance Armstrong begins entering races on a motorcycle, then the analogy will be appropriate.
[/quote]
It is a VERY valid analogy… First you said that force output from Lance is what is needed to peddle his bike? Are you implying that the powerlifter using a bench shirt does not have to apply force? Damn, all I need is my bench shirt and I will hit 1000lbs too… Lance riding a motorcycle is in no way equivalent to a bencher using a shirt. By saying so, you are implying the shirt does all the work. Wrong my friend. Lance uses a technologically advanced bike (lighter, more aerodynamic, etc.) to go faster and yes he is creating the force, the bike is just a mechanism that allows his performance to be better than it was previously. JUST LIKE the powerlifter. He uses a shirt to allow him to lift more weight, as well as protect himself from the weights he is lifting. The shirt ENHANCES performance, it doesn’t create it. If that were the case anyone who put a bench shirt on would hit 1000 no problem.
I remember an article a while back in which Dave Tate quoted Louie Simmons, something to the extent that Louie keeps a bottle of testosterone sitting on a bench shirt in his office and has yet to see it lift 5 lbs.
The shirt doesn’t make the lifter my friend, the lifter makes the shirt work.
BTW Now when we’re talking about benching raw. What is the worldrecord RAW benchpress?? Could be interesting to see just to compare the two lifts.
I think the “Raw” world record in the bench press is 713 or thereabouts (a little more?) done by Scott Mendelson.
Yes…RAW record is 713 by Mendy.
BTW, anybody know what Rychlak’s Raw numbers are, even if they’re gym lifts?
The damn bike analogy is a joke. You can say all you want about the shirt enhancing performance but how the heck do you explain having to pull the damn bar on your chest. The other poster never said that you don’t need to apply force to lift in the bench press, just that the shirt was using a couterforce to gravity. Lance’s bike does not apply any force output. The RAW bench record is the real deal as far as i’m concerned. laters pk
Shirt or not those numbers are huge!
Even if it gives him 40-50 ibs. BFD. I’d like to be able to break 1/2 that number.
[quote]pkradgreek wrote:
The damn bike analogy is a joke. You can say all you want about the shirt enhancing performance but how the heck do you explain having to pull the damn bar on your chest. The other poster never said that you don’t need to apply force to lift in the bench press, just that the shirt was using a couterforce to gravity. Lance’s bike does not apply any force output. The RAW bench record is the real deal as far as i’m concerned. laters pk[/quote]
IT’S ON! Seriously, folks, the two schools of thought on this issue are never going to see eye to eye.
It’ll be interesting to see just how high this record goes and at what point it starts to level off.
I just think you have to look at “Raw” benches vs. “Gear” benches as two different events or lifts. They are not comparable. Everybody knows you can’t come close to squatting “Raw” what you can do with a squat suit, wraps, and a thick belt… yet we rarely see arguments on that point. Peace brothers.
Shirts are not giving 40 or 50 pounds anymore. Try 200 to 300. Of course, Rychlak’s bench is still incredible.
ive never seen a bench shirt worn quite like Gene wore it in that video. it was new to me. i know inzer doesnt even make shirts that look like that. he must have had some major alterations but i still don’t see him gettin more than 250 out of that shirt.
I powerlift. I lift RAW. I train with powerlifters… they train (and compete) with GEAR. Using GEAR only makes sense because everyone is doing it in competition so you MUST as well to be competitive. OK, it seems no one but me likes the bike analogy but what about a large spring attached to one’s ass, while squatting? I personally don’t like gear at all. I know sprinters can improve thier times with better shoes and a high quality track surface improves times but would springs in thier footwear be kosher? Maybe if everyone used them. If I benched 425 raw and my competition also benched 425 raw yet he used a shirt in a comp. while I stayed raw and he hit 495… is he stronger? Nope!
I dont see a problem with it as long as the discussions and records are kept seperate to reflect the obviously significant advantage the shirts give.
Here is a quote from an interesting article I linked below:
Thanks for the link… a good article.
I was at the meet this weekend and saw the lift, It was at the 2004 IPA Sr. Nationals in Shamokin Dam PA.
It doesnt matter wether he is wearing equipment or not, its still the fact that the man held, and controlled over 1000 lbs.
If you notice from the tape he even paused at the top for a full 2 count, and the person who was judging from the back was none other than Louie Simmons
Check out www.irongame.com, they have videos there of Rychlak doing over 700 lbs. for 6 reps, I dont care who you are that is strength…but again this is my opinion